From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from [194.106.48.114] (helo=tim.rpsys.net ident=0) by linuxtogo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1J8lbb-0007Uv-Ja for openembedded-devel@openembedded.org; Sun, 30 Dec 2007 01:00:39 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tim.rpsys.net (8.13.6/8.13.8) with ESMTP id lBTNscMm014657; Sat, 29 Dec 2007 23:54:38 GMT Received: from tim.rpsys.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (tim.rpsys.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14044-09; Sat, 29 Dec 2007 23:54:35 +0000 (GMT) Received: from [192.168.1.15] (max.rpnet.com [192.168.1.15]) (authenticated bits=0) by tim.rpsys.net (8.13.6/8.13.8) with ESMTP id lBTNsWGm014649 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NO); Sat, 29 Dec 2007 23:54:32 GMT From: Richard Purdie To: "Dr. Mickey Lauer" , angstrom-distro-devel@linuxtogo.org In-Reply-To: <1773902313.20071222210858@vanille-media.de> References: <20071222144058.094eb363@cimmeria> <1773902313.20071222210858@vanille-media.de> Date: Sat, 29 Dec 2007 23:54:29 +0000 Message-Id: <1198972469.4654.37.camel@localhost.localdomain> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.10.1 X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rpsys.net Cc: openembedded-devel@openembedded.org Subject: Re: [Angstrom-devel] OE & Angstrom reputation (was: Bugzilla is not USENET) X-BeenThere: openembedded-devel@lists.openembedded.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: openembedded-devel@lists.openembedded.org List-Id: Using the OpenEmbedded metadata to build Distributions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2007 00:00:40 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Sat, 2007-12-22 at 21:08 +0100, Michael 'Mickey' Lauer wrote: > Graeme Gregory wrote: > > Guys the bickering in bugzilla is getting to the point where it > > is silly. > > > I personally don't feel that this lends a good impression of the OE > > project and the Angstrom distribution. > > > Also a lot of the actual arguments belong on the mailing list or private > > emails. People solving bugs don't need to know who annoys who. > > > Can I suggest people start applying the 24hr rule when acting on bugs. > > For those that don't know. This rule states if something annoys you > > wait 24hrs before you reply. Its an effective damper for flame wars. > > I couldn't agree more. Thanks for starting this thread, Graeme. > > Just recently the mood surrounding OpenEmbedded and Angstrom has been > dragged down by lots of small fights and arguments, often put in very > impolite and arrogant style. People are always leaving projects or starting > forks -- this is nothing new -- although usually they do this because > of technical differences, not because they're scared away or > threatened. > > I won't pick any individuals here, but rather want to alert you as a whole. > This is seriously compromising the reputation of our respective projects. > > A technically superior project can lose big time in a comparison when > it has a battlesome community. Guys, we're losing opportunities here! > > _Please_ try to act much more diplomatic, in word and deed. If you're angry, > swallow it down, think a day about it, and formulate a professional > statement. Don't haste. It's very important. I'm rather saddened to watch the way this thread is going after what Mickey asked :(. I'm not going to fan the flames and reply to the later emails directly, I just want to add my support to both Graeme's and Mickey's comments above. 1. The bickering in the bugzilla is petty and must stop. 2. The bickering on the mailing lists is equally petty and must stop. If it doesn't Angstrom dies and takes OE with it. It is as simple as that. I realise there are some tensions between certain developers. We don't all think the same, we don't all agree on everything. That is just life though, deal with it, preferably adults! Everyone concerned in this incessant bickering just ends up looking stupid and it undermines both their positions and that of the projects themselves. Keep in mind the latter is unfair on the other developers of said projects. I suspect there is *nothing* fundamental we don't all agree on? I'm assuming we all think that Angstrom and OE are good things and worth devoting time to, right? :). Play to our common goals and use these to override our differences. Remember that anyone asking a question means that person wants to learn something. That means *any* question someone asks is never a stupid or invalid question, just that some questions are harder to answer that others. The trick is finding a polite and helpful way to deal with questions including those which lack insight. I can guarantee everyone here has asked what in retrospect could be called a "stupid" question at some point in their life. Another important thing I caught glimpses of was something about the approachability of Angstrom/OE developers. We need to make sure we are approachable and that both users and developers feel this. Personally, I *never* want to get into a position where I'm unapproachable and I hope nobody else does either. On that note, if I'm not approachable, please tell me why and what I can do better (offlist if appropriate)... So, can everyone please try and work together nicely! Cheers, Richard