From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from sc8-sf-mx1-b.sourceforge.net ([10.3.1.11] helo=sc8-sf-mx1.sourceforge.net) by sc8-sf-list1.sourceforge.net with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1CxGPd-0006ZL-HX for user-mode-linux-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; Fri, 04 Feb 2005 19:15:09 -0800 Received: from dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net ([66.92.53.140] helo=grelber.thyrsus.com) by sc8-sf-mx1.sourceforge.net with esmtp (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.41) id 1CxGPc-0002Uw-RP for user-mode-linux-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; Fri, 04 Feb 2005 19:15:09 -0800 From: Rob Landley Subject: Sky, comma, falling. (Was Re: [uml-devel] Xen going to be in Kernel 2.6 soon?) References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" Message-Id: <200502042113.13876.rob@landley.net> Sender: user-mode-linux-devel-admin@lists.sourceforge.net Errors-To: user-mode-linux-devel-admin@lists.sourceforge.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: The user-mode Linux development list List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 21:13:13 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To: user-mode-linux-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Cc: Sven =?iso-8859-15?q?K=F6hler?= On Friday 04 February 2005 08:45 pm, Sven K=F6hler wrote: > I feel like this is a slap in Jeff's face, since i thought=20 > that UML will be developed as the first choice in virtualizations=20 > techniques. Yup, just like the inclusion of reiserfs in the kernel is a slap in the fac= e=20 to ext3. Obviously they did it just to be insulting, didn't you read Linus= 's=20 "I'm a bastard" speech? > So what is it all about? When should somebody chose Xen, and when should > somebody chose UML? and how will UML and Xen compete? You know, ever since the release of the BSD source code in 1992 totally=20 derailed that "Linux" project people were playing with back then, this kind= =20 of question has become vitally important. The release of any remotely=20 similar project obviously can immediately halt all development of establish= ed=20 projects that developers have sunk years of effort into, and they immediate= ly=20 start porting over things like the COW mounts and hostfs and honeypot procf= s,=20 and rewrite all the existing tutorials and retrain everybody overnight to=20 work on the new as yet untested thingy that hasn't been particularly debugg= ed=20 yet. Especially in a case like this, where Xen actually competes with VMWare rat= her=20 than UML. Obviously, UML is doomed. What with Xen requiring a modified ho= st=20 kernel to provide its virtualization environment whereas UML uses the proce= ss=20 abstraction to virtualize it: I mean, who's going to use _processes_ in fiv= e=20 years, will future kernels even bother to support them? Sure, UML not only= =20 runs on an unmodified Linux kernel (even running a 2.6 UML on a 2.2 host=20 kernel), and even an effort underway to get it running on windows (who know= s=20 why, but a MacOS X host can only be a matter of time), but that just means = maybe it can scrape on some tiny niches once it's driven off Linux by this = new "Adeos" thing... Er, I mean "Plex86"... Um... "Xen", that's it. And= =20 obviously its original use as a Linux development tool letting you do thing= s=20 like create a filesystem driver and mount an instance of it without=20 destablizing your host kernel, or run bits of the kernel under normal=20 userspace debugging tools... Well, we're well rid of that, aren't we? And= =20 being to swap kernel memory to backing store just like a regular applicatio= n,=20 that was obviously a bad idea from day one... Why was the question interesting again? Rob ------------------------------------------------------- This SF.Net email is sponsored by: IntelliVIEW -- Interactive Reporting Tool for open source databases. Create drag-&-drop reports. Save time by over 75%! Publish reports on the web. Export to DOC, XLS, RTF, etc. Download a FREE copy at http://www.intelliview.com/go/osdn_nl _______________________________________________ User-mode-linux-devel mailing list User-mode-linux-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/user-mode-linux-devel