From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.43) id 1LZuWE-000614-L9 for mharc-grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:03:50 -0500 Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LZuWC-0005yx-6l for grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:03:48 -0500 Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LZuW6-0005tr-TL for grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:03:47 -0500 Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=58037 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LZuW6-0005tg-HE for grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:03:42 -0500 Received: from arnold.marlboro.edu ([206.192.68.78]:50239) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1LZuW5-0002in-SJ for grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:03:42 -0500 Received: from akbar.marlboro.edu (akbar.marlboro.edu [10.1.2.5]) by arnold.marlboro.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 107A61780DB; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:03:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from xyz.marlboro.edu (xyz.marlboro.edu [10.1.2.29]) by akbar.marlboro.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AAC011E558; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:03:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from east.localnet (mdhcp5-170.marlboro.edu [10.1.5.170]) by xyz.marlboro.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C37A3AC01C; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:03:31 -0500 (EST) From: Isaac Dupree To: grub-devel@gnu.org Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:03:28 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.10.3 (Linux/2.6.27-11-generic; KDE/4.1.3; x86_64; ; ) References: <200902180952.10351.ml@isaac.cedarswampstudios.org> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200902181703.29234.ml@isaac.cedarswampstudios.org> X-Marlboro-MailScanner-Information: Please contact techsupport@marlboro.edu for more information X-Marlboro-MailScanner: Found to be clean, clean X-Marlboro-Information: Please contact techsupport@marlboro.edu for more information X-Marlboro-MailScanner-ID: 107A61780DB.0CBF1 X-Marlboro-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (not cached, score=-4.399, required 6, autolearn=disabled, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, BAYES_00 -2.60) X-Marlboro-MailScanner-From: ml@isaac.cedarswampstudios.org X-Marlboro-MailScanner-Watermark: 1235599419.8606@CHKFUUgO6yDkPPmLcHNMsQ X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) Cc: Alex Besogonov Subject: Re: A _good_ and valid use for TPM X-BeenThere: grub-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: The development of GRUB 2 List-Id: The development of GRUB 2 List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 22:03:48 -0000 Alex Besogonov wrote: > On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 4:52 PM, Isaac Dupree > > wrote: > > Alex Besogonov wrote: > > But guess what? While your system is running, they can take out your RAM > > and read it (disk-encryption key and all) before the RAM forgets its > > contents, see e.g. http://blogs.zdnet.com/security/?p=900 > > I know. But there's no way to guard against this attack, so there's no > sense fretting over it for now. well, it's relatively straightforward for an attacker who knows what they're doing, so perhaps you should assume that *privacy* is at least partly compromised. but the most that attack can achieve is observing? Can that attack make it so that, when the system starts running again, it will be in a compromised state? - they can steal all crypto identity keys and try to run a completely different computer with different software there, if not for TPM - I don't know how the magic of TPM knowing everything about the state of your computer works, maybe they can modify what's in memory and put it back and confuse things? Also why does GRUB need to do any explicit interaction with TPM? (I'm ignorant and unimportant here, but maybe it will edify people, to have this conversation.) -Isaac