From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1762875AbZBYQVi (ORCPT ); Wed, 25 Feb 2009 11:21:38 -0500 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org id S1762065AbZBYQVU (ORCPT ); Wed, 25 Feb 2009 11:21:20 -0500 Received: from mail-fx0-f176.google.com ([209.85.220.176]:33450 "EHLO mail-fx0-f176.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1756713AbZBYQVS (ORCPT ); Wed, 25 Feb 2009 11:21:18 -0500 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-type:content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; b=Yzlc9jFNJ4Q1a2F2/edoqsipYodjTND5aTKAMrb5hIxU2rIB69WSiHMNb2qmS7WtME mqWxyDAObIg0mbm1Wk8q1SaAsy0Cik/cNeE9Z7E43N/5xBibj23Ofd+kp4VKogj0rB+e ktXMkggcIH5+rkWWZZwYtG/jGJ8swZieC1WWk= Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 17:21:11 +0100 From: Frederic Weisbecker To: Ingo Molnar Cc: Andrew Morton , Pekka Enberg , Steven Rostedt , LKML , Thomas Gleixner , Peter Zijlstra , Theodore Tso , Arjan van de Ven , Pekka Paalanen , Arnaldo Carvalho de Melo , Jason Baron , Martin Bligh , Mathieu Desnoyers , "Frank Ch. Eigler" , KOSAKI Motohiro , Jens Axboe , Masami Hiramatsu , Steven Rostedt Subject: Re: [PATCH 2/4] tracing: add event trace infrastructure Message-ID: <20090225162110.GB5862@nowhere> References: <20090224194548.3effb746.akpm@linux-foundation.org> <20090224203308.8d623e0b.akpm@linux-foundation.org> <20090225081118.GC15303@elte.hu> <20090225002852.5ef5b869.akpm@linux-foundation.org> <84144f020902250100k41e55dd7w8a9c8d2ca96908ea@mail.gmail.com> <20090225012250.db68e480.akpm@linux-foundation.org> <1235554387.3849.30.camel@penberg-laptop> <20090225014442.7b7b7726.akpm@linux-foundation.org> <20090225095623.GB12352@elte.hu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20090225095623.GB12352@elte.hu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Wed, Feb 25, 2009 at 10:56:23AM +0100, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > * Andrew Morton wrote: > > > Plus... it's all English-only. > > Note that with bin+raw output you can already internationalize > tracepoints, if you want to. > > I havent seen much interest in that, and the default tracing > output is in English indeed, and the reason is rather > fundamental: currently we've got 60,000+ kernel function > symbols, 99% of which are in English. Neither do I use the raw/bin formats from ftrace personally, but they are used by automated tools such as userspace side sysprof, blktrace, ... Frederic. > Do you argue for them to be converted to some i8n format so that > the trace output becomes readable in other languages as well? > > I.e. do you suggest that this: > > > 3) | handle_mm_fault() { > > 3) | count_vm_event() { > > 3) 0.243 us | test_ti_thread_flag(); > > 3) 0.754 us | } > > 3) 0.249 us | pud_alloc(); > > 3) 0.251 us | pmd_alloc(); > > 3) | __do_fault() { > > 3) | filemap_fault() { > > 3) | find_lock_page() { > > 3) | find_get_page() { > > 3) 0.248 us | test_ti_thread_flag(); > > 3) 0.844 us | } > > 3) 1.341 us | } > > 3) 1.837 us | } > > 3) 0.275 us | _spin_lock(); > > 3) 0.257 us | page_add_file_rmap(); > > 3) 0.233 us | native_set_pte_at(); > > and /proc/kallsysms to be internationalized? Should all oopses > and warnings that show up in the kernel log be translated as > well? > > I dont think it's realistic - and arguing for anything less and > singling out tracing would be a double standard. > > Currently being able to understand and hack the kernel means > being able to read some English - and the same holds for trace > output as well. > > The default output of traces is just a mirror image of what is > the kernel status quo. If the kernel gets internationalized so > will ftrace be internationalized too. > > > > So if you're arguing against specific ftrace plugins, go > > > ahead (you probably have a fair point there). But please > > > don't dismiss the while _concept_ of ftrace because of them. > > > > Where on earth did that come from? > > > > What I'm arguing against is putting English-only > > pretty-printers and pretty-parsers on wrong side of int 80. > > That's all. > > Since the concept of a kernel tracing facility being > self-sufficient and being easy to use is an integral and key > concept to ftrace, dont you see why people take your suggestions > as a dismissal of the ftrace concept? > > Ingo