From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from v6.tansi.org (ns.km31936-01.keymachine.de [87.118.116.4]) by mail.server123.net (Postfix) with ESMTP for ; Thu, 2 Apr 2015 17:48:02 +0200 (CEST) Received: from gatewagner.dyndns.org (77-57-54-224.dclient.hispeed.ch [77.57.54.224]) by v6.tansi.org (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 565BE20DC13E for ; Thu, 2 Apr 2015 17:48:02 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 17:48:01 +0200 From: Arno Wagner Message-ID: <20150402154801.GA22576@tansi.org> References: <551CDF3E.4020407@billmairsolutions.ltd.uk> <20150402102027.GA18528@tansi.org> <551D1CF9.9020502@billmairsolutions.ltd.uk> <20150402120848.GC18528@tansi.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [dm-crypt] Proposal for support of PKCS#11 devices (SmartCards and Tokens) List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , To: dm-crypt@saout.de On Thu, Apr 02, 2015 at 14:38:28 CEST, Nick Econopouly wrote: > "2-factor authentication is a large field with many dysfunctional > solutions (biometrics, for example, or numerous insecure hardware > tokens), and no final good solutions are in sight. Hence it is not > something that has a place in cryptsetup proper, beyond what is > already there. You can also always treat the passphrase as the secret > and protect that with your chosen 2-factor authentication scheme." > > I've been interested in the hardware tokens you mentioned; are the yubikey > and the upcoming nitrokey insecure? > > (For 2fa, I assume the gnupg features are more secure because they at > least require a pin) > > -nick The think is that in the past most chipcards were broken, some in ridiculously simple fashions. At the same time, people do not realize this. I have even heard some security people call a smartcard a "mini-HSM". The problem is that makeing a secure token is hard and expensive. For example, it needs always-on sensors that can wipe it in case of attacks on the hardware. Sure, a hardware token of any kind usually gives you a significant security boost as most people chose insecure passwords, but that is basically it. If a user uses secure passwords, 2-factor will just annoy. Gr"usse, Arno -- Arno Wagner, Dr. sc. techn., Dipl. Inform., Email: arno@wagner.name GnuPG: ID: CB5D9718 FP: 12D6 C03B 1B30 33BB 13CF B774 E35C 5FA1 CB5D 9718 ---- A good decision is based on knowledge and not on numbers. -- Plato If it's in the news, don't worry about it. The very definition of "news" is "something that hardly ever happens." -- Bruce Schneier