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From: Ingo Molnar <mingo@kernel.org>
To: David Hildenbrand <dahi@linux.vnet.ibm.com>
Cc: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, mingo@redhat.com,
	yang.shi@windriver.com, bigeasy@linutronix.de,
	benh@kernel.crashing.org, paulus@samba.org,
	akpm@linux-foundation.org, heiko.carstens@de.ibm.com,
	schwidefsky@de.ibm.com, borntraeger@de.ibm.com, mst@redhat.com,
	tglx@linutronix.de, David.Laight@ACULAB.COM, hughd@google.com,
	hocko@suse.cz, ralf@linux-mips.org, herbert@gondor.apana.org.au,
	linux@arm.linux.org.uk, airlied@linux.ie,
	daniel.vetter@intel.com, linux-mm@kvack.org,
	linux-arch@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH RFC 01/15] uaccess: count pagefault_disable() levels in pagefault_disabled
Date: Thu, 7 May 2015 13:12:39 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20150507111239.GB15284@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20150507125053.5d2e8f0a@thinkpad-w530>


* David Hildenbrand <dahi@linux.vnet.ibm.com> wrote:

> > AFAICR we did this to avoid having to do both:
> > 
> > 	preempt_disable();
> > 	pagefault_disable();
> > 
> > in a fair number of places -- just like this patch-set does, this is
> > touching two cachelines where one would have been enough.
> > 
> > Also, removing in_atomic() from fault handlers like you did
> > significantly changes semantics for interrupts (soft, hard and NMI).
> > 
> > So while I agree with most of these patches, I'm very hesitant on the
> > above little detail.
> 
> Just to make sure we have a common understanding (as written in my 
> cover letter):
> 
> Your suggestion won't work with !CONFIG_PREEMPT 
> (!CONFIG_PREEMPT_COUNT). If there is no preempt counter, in_atomic() 
> won't work. So doing a preempt_disable() instead of a 
> pagefault_disable() is not going to work. (not sure how -RT handles 
> that - most probably with CONFIG_PREEMPT_COUNT being enabled, due to 
> atomic debug).
> 
> That's why I dropped that check for a reason.

So, what's the point of disabling the preempt counter?

Looks like the much simpler (and faster) solution would be to 
eliminate CONFIG_PREEMPT_COUNT (i.e. make it always available), and 
use it for pagefault-disable.

> This patchset is about decoupling both concept. (not ending up with 
> to mechanisms doing almost the same)

So that's really backwards: just because we might not have a handy 
counter we introduce _another one_, and duplicate checks for it ;-)

Why not keep a single counter, if indeed what we care about most in 
the pagefault_disable() case is atomicity?

Thanks,

	Ingo

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Ingo Molnar <mingo@kernel.org>
To: David Hildenbrand <dahi@linux.vnet.ibm.com>
Cc: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, mingo@redhat.com,
	yang.shi@windriver.com, bigeasy@linutronix.de,
	benh@kernel.crashing.org, paulus@samba.org,
	akpm@linux-foundation.org, heiko.carstens@de.ibm.com,
	schwidefsky@de.ibm.com, borntraeger@de.ibm.com, mst@redhat.com,
	tglx@linutronix.de, David.Laight@ACULAB.COM, hughd@google.com,
	hocko@suse.cz, ralf@linux-mips.org, herbert@gondor.apana.org.au,
	linux@arm.linux.org.uk, airlied@linux.ie,
	daniel.vetter@intel.com, linux-mm@kvack.org,
	linux-arch@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH RFC 01/15] uaccess: count pagefault_disable() levels in pagefault_disabled
Date: Thu, 7 May 2015 13:12:39 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20150507111239.GB15284@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20150507125053.5d2e8f0a@thinkpad-w530>


* David Hildenbrand <dahi@linux.vnet.ibm.com> wrote:

> > AFAICR we did this to avoid having to do both:
> > 
> > 	preempt_disable();
> > 	pagefault_disable();
> > 
> > in a fair number of places -- just like this patch-set does, this is
> > touching two cachelines where one would have been enough.
> > 
> > Also, removing in_atomic() from fault handlers like you did
> > significantly changes semantics for interrupts (soft, hard and NMI).
> > 
> > So while I agree with most of these patches, I'm very hesitant on the
> > above little detail.
> 
> Just to make sure we have a common understanding (as written in my 
> cover letter):
> 
> Your suggestion won't work with !CONFIG_PREEMPT 
> (!CONFIG_PREEMPT_COUNT). If there is no preempt counter, in_atomic() 
> won't work. So doing a preempt_disable() instead of a 
> pagefault_disable() is not going to work. (not sure how -RT handles 
> that - most probably with CONFIG_PREEMPT_COUNT being enabled, due to 
> atomic debug).
> 
> That's why I dropped that check for a reason.

So, what's the point of disabling the preempt counter?

Looks like the much simpler (and faster) solution would be to 
eliminate CONFIG_PREEMPT_COUNT (i.e. make it always available), and 
use it for pagefault-disable.

> This patchset is about decoupling both concept. (not ending up with 
> to mechanisms doing almost the same)

So that's really backwards: just because we might not have a handy 
counter we introduce _another one_, and duplicate checks for it ;-)

Why not keep a single counter, if indeed what we care about most in 
the pagefault_disable() case is atomicity?

Thanks,

	Ingo

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  parent reply	other threads:[~2015-05-07 11:12 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 79+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-05-06 17:50 [PATCH RFC 00/15] decouple pagefault_disable() from preempt_disable() David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 01/15] uaccess: count pagefault_disable() levels in pagefault_disabled David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 10:22   ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 10:22     ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 10:50     ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 10:50       ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 10:50       ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 11:12       ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 11:12         ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 11:23         ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 11:23           ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 11:25           ` Ingo Molnar
2015-05-07 11:25             ` Ingo Molnar
2015-05-07 11:30             ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 11:30               ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 11:42           ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 11:42             ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 11:40         ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 11:40           ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 11:48           ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 11:48             ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 11:51           ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 11:51             ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 12:14             ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 12:14               ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 12:27               ` Ingo Molnar
2015-05-07 12:27                 ` Ingo Molnar
2015-05-07 12:32               ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 12:32                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 15:45             ` [PATCH draft] mm: use pagefault_disable() to check for disabled pagefaults in the handler David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 15:45               ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07 11:12       ` Ingo Molnar [this message]
2015-05-07 11:12         ` [PATCH RFC 01/15] uaccess: count pagefault_disable() levels in pagefault_disabled Ingo Molnar
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 02/15] mm, uaccess: trigger might_sleep() in might_fault() with disabled pagefaults David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 03/15] uaccess: clarify that uaccess may only sleep if pagefaults are enabled David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 04/15] mm: explicitly disable/enable preemption in kmap_atomic_* David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 05/15] mips: kmap_coherent relies on disabled preemption David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 06/15] mm: use pagefault_disabled() to check for disabled pagefaults David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 07/15] drm/i915: " David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 08/15] futex: UP futex_atomic_op_inuser() relies on disabled preemption David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 09/15] futex: UP futex_atomic_cmpxchg_inatomic() " David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 10/15] arm/futex: " David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 11/15] arm/futex: UP futex_atomic_op_inuser() " David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 12/15] futex: clarify that preemption doesn't have to be disabled David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 13/15] powerpc: enable_kernel_altivec() requires disabled preemption David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07  0:21   ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2015-05-07  0:21     ` Benjamin Herrenschmidt
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 14/15] mips: properly lock access to the fpu David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50 ` [PATCH RFC 15/15] uaccess: decouple preemption from the pagefault logic David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 17:50   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-06 22:01 ` [PATCH RFC 00/15] decouple pagefault_disable() from preempt_disable() Andrew Morton
2015-05-06 22:01   ` Andrew Morton
2015-05-07  6:23   ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07  6:23     ` David Hildenbrand
2015-05-07  9:48   ` Ingo Molnar
2015-05-07  9:48     ` Ingo Molnar
2015-05-07 10:51     ` Christian Borntraeger
2015-05-07 10:51       ` Christian Borntraeger
2015-05-07 11:08       ` Ingo Molnar
2015-05-07 11:08         ` Ingo Molnar
2015-05-07 11:40         ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-05-07 11:40           ` Peter Zijlstra

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