From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Alan Cox Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 12:35:58 +0000 Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH v2 00/13] Kernel based bootsplash Message-Id: <20171231123558.7136f0c6@alans-desktop> List-Id: References: <20171213194755.3409-1-mstaudt@suse.de> <20171219161630.GI26573@phenom.ffwll.local> <2f8a1a08-911d-a511-2968-4d89418ac212@suse.de> <573d4050-7607-b8e4-7552-83966f551ba3@suse.de> In-Reply-To: <573d4050-7607-b8e4-7552-83966f551ba3@suse.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Max Staudt Cc: Linux Fbdev development list , michal@markovi.net, Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz , sndirsch@suse.com, Oliver Neukum , Takashi Iwai , dri-devel , Linux Kernel Mailing List , philm@manjaro.org, Bero =?UTF-8?B?Um9zZW5rcsOkbnplcg==?= On Tue, 19 Dec 2017 19:40:12 +0100 Max Staudt wrote: > On 12/19/2017 06:26 PM, Daniel Vetter wrote: > > On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 6:04 PM, Max Staudt wrote: > >> Well, those could enable fbcon if they want the bootsplash. Shouldn't make a difference anyway if they're powerful enough to run Linux. As long as the bootsplash is shown, no fbcon drawing operations are executed, so there is no expensive scrolling or such to hog the system. > > > > It's too big, and those folks tend to be super picky about space. > > I know, they really are. > > However, given just how big and clunky modern systems have become, I raise my doubts about a few extra KB for fbcon code to be relevant. For embedded every KB counts. That is likely to remain the same for some time because at the end of the day small devices are constrained about the amount of SRAM you can put on die and the amount of power you can afford for DRAM. > > this by ignoring it an adding a hole new layer on top. That doesn't > > sound like any kind of good idea to me. > > Yes. It is a vast improvement over the status quo, and people are asking for it. And the bootsplash layer can be moved elsewhere, just change the hooks and keep the loading/rendering. > > Also, gfx driver loading isn't a dumpster fire, it mostly just works. It just mustn't be done 100% carelessly. It's a total mess (the fbcon layer loading and locking that is). Doing all this extra kernel stuff is like sitting in a hole and instead of trying to climb out digging the hole bigger so you've got more room to sit in it. Alan From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Alan Cox Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH v2 00/13] Kernel based bootsplash Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 12:35:58 +0000 Message-ID: <20171231123558.7136f0c6@alans-desktop> References: <20171213194755.3409-1-mstaudt@suse.de> <20171219161630.GI26573@phenom.ffwll.local> <2f8a1a08-911d-a511-2968-4d89418ac212@suse.de> <573d4050-7607-b8e4-7552-83966f551ba3@suse.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Return-path: Received: from fuzix.org (www.llwyncelyn.cymru [82.70.14.225]) by gabe.freedesktop.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3C74389BAF for ; Sun, 31 Dec 2017 12:36:05 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <573d4050-7607-b8e4-7552-83966f551ba3@suse.de> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dri-devel-bounces@lists.freedesktop.org Sender: "dri-devel" To: Max Staudt Cc: Linux Fbdev development list , michal@markovi.net, Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz , sndirsch@suse.com, Oliver Neukum , Takashi Iwai , dri-devel , Linux Kernel Mailing List , philm@manjaro.org, Bero =?UTF-8?B?Um9zZW5rcsOkbnplcg==?= List-Id: dri-devel@lists.freedesktop.org T24gVHVlLCAxOSBEZWMgMjAxNyAxOTo0MDoxMiArMDEwMApNYXggU3RhdWR0IDxtc3RhdWR0QHN1 c2UuZGU+IHdyb3RlOgoKPiBPbiAxMi8xOS8yMDE3IDA2OjI2IFBNLCBEYW5pZWwgVmV0dGVyIHdy b3RlOgo+ID4gT24gVHVlLCBEZWMgMTksIDIwMTcgYXQgNjowNCBQTSwgTWF4IFN0YXVkdCA8bXN0 YXVkdEBzdXNlLmRlPiB3cm90ZTogIAo+ID4+IFdlbGwsIHRob3NlIGNvdWxkIGVuYWJsZSBmYmNv biBpZiB0aGV5IHdhbnQgdGhlIGJvb3RzcGxhc2guIFNob3VsZG4ndCBtYWtlIGEgZGlmZmVyZW5j ZSBhbnl3YXkgaWYgdGhleSdyZSBwb3dlcmZ1bCBlbm91Z2ggdG8gcnVuIExpbnV4LiBBcyBsb25n IGFzIHRoZSBib290c3BsYXNoIGlzIHNob3duLCBubyBmYmNvbiBkcmF3aW5nIG9wZXJhdGlvbnMg YXJlIGV4ZWN1dGVkLCBzbyB0aGVyZSBpcyBubyBleHBlbnNpdmUgc2Nyb2xsaW5nIG9yIHN1Y2gg dG8gaG9nIHRoZSBzeXN0ZW0uICAKPiA+IAo+ID4gSXQncyB0b28gYmlnLCBhbmQgdGhvc2UgZm9s a3MgdGVuZCB0byBiZSBzdXBlciBwaWNreSBhYm91dCBzcGFjZS4gIAo+IAo+IEkga25vdywgdGhl eSByZWFsbHkgYXJlLgo+IAo+IEhvd2V2ZXIsIGdpdmVuIGp1c3QgaG93IGJpZyBhbmQgY2x1bmt5 IG1vZGVybiBzeXN0ZW1zIGhhdmUgYmVjb21lLCBJIHJhaXNlIG15IGRvdWJ0cyBhYm91dCBhIGZl dyBleHRyYSBLQiBmb3IgZmJjb24gY29kZSB0byBiZSByZWxldmFudC4KCkZvciBlbWJlZGRlZCBl dmVyeSBLQiBjb3VudHMuIFRoYXQgaXMgbGlrZWx5IHRvIHJlbWFpbiB0aGUgc2FtZSBmb3Igc29t ZQp0aW1lIGJlY2F1c2UgYXQgdGhlIGVuZCBvZiB0aGUgZGF5IHNtYWxsIGRldmljZXMgYXJlIGNv bnN0cmFpbmVkIGFib3V0IHRoZQphbW91bnQgb2YgU1JBTSB5b3UgY2FuIHB1dCBvbiBkaWUgYW5k IHRoZSBhbW91bnQgb2YgcG93ZXIgeW91IGNhbiBhZmZvcmQKZm9yIERSQU0uIAoKPiA+IHRoaXMg YnkgaWdub3JpbmcgaXQgYW4gYWRkaW5nIGEgaG9sZSBuZXcgbGF5ZXIgb24gdG9wLiBUaGF0IGRv ZXNuJ3QKPiA+IHNvdW5kIGxpa2UgYW55IGtpbmQgb2YgZ29vZCBpZGVhIHRvIG1lLiAgCj4gCj4g WWVzLiBJdCBpcyBhIHZhc3QgaW1wcm92ZW1lbnQgb3ZlciB0aGUgc3RhdHVzIHF1bywgYW5kIHBl b3BsZSBhcmUgYXNraW5nIGZvciBpdC4gQW5kIHRoZSBib290c3BsYXNoIGxheWVyIGNhbiBiZSBt b3ZlZCBlbHNld2hlcmUsIGp1c3QgY2hhbmdlIHRoZSBob29rcyBhbmQga2VlcCB0aGUgbG9hZGlu Zy9yZW5kZXJpbmcuCj4gCj4gQWxzbywgZ2Z4IGRyaXZlciBsb2FkaW5nIGlzbid0IGEgZHVtcHN0 ZXIgZmlyZSwgaXQgbW9zdGx5IGp1c3Qgd29ya3MuIEl0IGp1c3QgbXVzdG4ndCBiZSBkb25lIDEw MCUgY2FyZWxlc3NseS4KCkl0J3MgYSB0b3RhbCBtZXNzICh0aGUgZmJjb24gbGF5ZXIgbG9hZGlu ZyBhbmQgbG9ja2luZyB0aGF0IGlzKS4gRG9pbmcgYWxsCnRoaXMgZXh0cmEga2VybmVsIHN0dWZm IGlzIGxpa2Ugc2l0dGluZyBpbiBhIGhvbGUgYW5kIGluc3RlYWQgb2YgdHJ5aW5nIHRvCmNsaW1i IG91dCBkaWdnaW5nIHRoZSBob2xlIGJpZ2dlciBzbyB5b3UndmUgZ290IG1vcmUgcm9vbSB0byBz aXQgaW4gaXQuCgpBbGFuCl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fCmRyaS1kZXZlbCBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QKZHJpLWRldmVsQGxpc3RzLmZyZWVkZXNrdG9w Lm9yZwpodHRwczovL2xpc3RzLmZyZWVkZXNrdG9wLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2RyaS1k ZXZlbAo= From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1751154AbdLaMgc (ORCPT ); Sun, 31 Dec 2017 07:36:32 -0500 Received: from www.llwyncelyn.cymru ([82.70.14.225]:55514 "EHLO fuzix.org" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1750762AbdLaMga (ORCPT ); Sun, 31 Dec 2017 07:36:30 -0500 Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2017 12:35:58 +0000 From: Alan Cox To: Max Staudt Cc: Daniel Vetter , Bartlomiej Zolnierkiewicz , Linux Fbdev development list , michal@markovi.net, sndirsch@suse.com, Oliver Neukum , Takashi Iwai , dri-devel , Linux Kernel Mailing List , Bero =?UTF-8?B?Um9zZW5rcsOkbnplcg==?= , philm@manjaro.org Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH v2 00/13] Kernel based bootsplash Message-ID: <20171231123558.7136f0c6@alans-desktop> In-Reply-To: <573d4050-7607-b8e4-7552-83966f551ba3@suse.de> References: <20171213194755.3409-1-mstaudt@suse.de> <20171219161630.GI26573@phenom.ffwll.local> <2f8a1a08-911d-a511-2968-4d89418ac212@suse.de> <573d4050-7607-b8e4-7552-83966f551ba3@suse.de> Organization: Intel Corporation X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.15.1-dirty (GTK+ 2.24.31; x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: linux-kernel-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org On Tue, 19 Dec 2017 19:40:12 +0100 Max Staudt wrote: > On 12/19/2017 06:26 PM, Daniel Vetter wrote: > > On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 6:04 PM, Max Staudt wrote: > >> Well, those could enable fbcon if they want the bootsplash. Shouldn't make a difference anyway if they're powerful enough to run Linux. As long as the bootsplash is shown, no fbcon drawing operations are executed, so there is no expensive scrolling or such to hog the system. > > > > It's too big, and those folks tend to be super picky about space. > > I know, they really are. > > However, given just how big and clunky modern systems have become, I raise my doubts about a few extra KB for fbcon code to be relevant. For embedded every KB counts. That is likely to remain the same for some time because at the end of the day small devices are constrained about the amount of SRAM you can put on die and the amount of power you can afford for DRAM. > > this by ignoring it an adding a hole new layer on top. That doesn't > > sound like any kind of good idea to me. > > Yes. It is a vast improvement over the status quo, and people are asking for it. And the bootsplash layer can be moved elsewhere, just change the hooks and keep the loading/rendering. > > Also, gfx driver loading isn't a dumpster fire, it mostly just works. It just mustn't be done 100% carelessly. It's a total mess (the fbcon layer loading and locking that is). Doing all this extra kernel stuff is like sitting in a hole and instead of trying to climb out digging the hole bigger so you've got more room to sit in it. Alan