From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from verein.lst.de (verein.lst.de [213.95.11.211]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 77B9E146D59; Tue, 24 Sep 2024 09:28:38 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=213.95.11.211 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1727170120; cv=none; b=NJhWn6dDMc7nNfYB6g+ISuM6sJDHcDjhIU8dDMI0/zjwHOuj9tAfc5/Os2qbOM3VwB6j6J08p4KRRktSrln+AXneYraoxUTfuIbowNPgKbVecIkTf560HCynqJizrS48rFnHMjtPW6t8nG+YyU7cz5EdqeNK6bxvCwPCAbF5/WQ= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1727170120; c=relaxed/simple; bh=fjVVmIrEi0o8jKXEV+bEzfwsrbypruhXbD3Jk5awKw4=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:References:MIME-Version: Content-Type:Content-Disposition:In-Reply-To; b=tEjT5TLPSiyfRqfzaDpfQe6OtdpZmw17E9kCooEpCAh2zal1NS+bKI+YgmFjupYiDbc6Dssr0Lz+vwHLwoDBmlVLX430m4GkYqNQKrV8TBdmMOVNGwb7RzyD5mWSO/T10j2tYnqBUmiPPXdmucJubBdLVVtHe38IQfjltn8Z94Y= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=lst.de; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=lst.de; arc=none smtp.client-ip=213.95.11.211 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=lst.de Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=lst.de Received: by verein.lst.de (Postfix, from userid 2407) id EE8A1227A8E; Tue, 24 Sep 2024 11:28:32 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2024 11:28:32 +0200 From: Christoph Hellwig To: Kanchan Joshi Cc: Christoph Hellwig , axboe@kernel.dk, kbusch@kernel.org, sagi@grimberg.me, martin.petersen@oracle.com, James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com, brauner@kernel.org, viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk, jack@suse.cz, jaegeuk@kernel.org, jlayton@kernel.org, chuck.lever@oracle.com, bvanassche@acm.org, linux-nvme@lists.infradead.org, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-scsi@vger.kernel.org, gost.dev@samsung.com, vishak.g@samsung.com, javier.gonz@samsung.com, Nitesh Shetty Subject: Re: [PATCH v5 4/5] sd: limit to use write life hints Message-ID: <20240924092832.GA26208@lst.de> References: <20240912130235.GB28535@lst.de> <20240913080659.GA30525@lst.de> <4a39215a-1b0e-3832-93bd-61e422705f8b@samsung.com> <20240917062007.GA4170@lst.de> <20240918064258.GA32627@lst.de> <197b2c1a-66d2-5f5a-c258-7e2f35eff8e4@samsung.com> <20240918120159.GA20658@lst.de> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-block@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.17 (2007-11-01) On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 02:54:51PM +0530, Kanchan Joshi wrote: > FS managed/created hints is a different topic altogether, > and honestly > that is not the scope of this series. That needs to be thought at per-FS > level due to different data/meta layouts. No, it is not. If you design an API where hints bypass the file system you fundamentally do the wrong thing when there is a file system. No one is asking to actually implement file system support in this series, but we need to consider the fundamental problem in the API design. And yes, the actual implementation will be highly dependent on the file system. > This scope of this series is to enable application-managed hints passing > through the file system. FS only needs to pass what it receives. Which fundamentally can't work for even a semi-intelligent file system. From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from lists.sourceforge.net (lists.sourceforge.net [216.105.38.7]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 66DA3CF9C71 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2024 09:28:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=sfs-ml-3.v29.lw.sourceforge.com) by sfs-ml-3.v29.lw.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.95) (envelope-from ) id 1st1ql-000277-O7; Tue, 24 Sep 2024 09:28:51 +0000 Received: from [172.30.29.66] (helo=mx.sourceforge.net) by sfs-ml-3.v29.lw.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.95) (envelope-from ) id 1st1qk-000270-2s for linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; Tue, 24 Sep 2024 09:28:49 +0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sourceforge.net; s=x; h=In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version:References: Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=5m4RQ4VNBFMhAoRV2E/TBCUs2t7JhJdQ63Itw1dMMK4=; b=bMybGGixSimv1SfA7Kl/ea+L3y 7/E/WBj1LUM6ytr7hOraYuMXSlWqJE7n32lwqfkfvmIUVegXvhhTXdhCcKuZfTicw2VRW8GONDYg3 9GGSODxFtA9437TSI+OJU0zDDtAHhsBl1HKkborUwfpSOs3fygQ60zK9lfVMqPq7OU6E=; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sf.net; s=x ; h=In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version:References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To :From:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=5m4RQ4VNBFMhAoRV2E/TBCUs2t7JhJdQ63Itw1dMMK4=; b=X548n47m7e4j8L+TXaDe/RK8Dw 6BtftDN7pLgruO3hzVH3Ixoi6bc+bcDWEW5W4o3GmmL6qpyA2z5PEu0A4I4Qqi4iRaRmgZnPBVl+c BtsJDAVdsXrKz5Q5EqwTEneYS9mH6FosMWFRQmsG9p8RLGxtsnBl2YloTbMHR2MbHCLY=; Received: from verein.lst.de ([213.95.11.211]) by sfi-mx-2.v28.lw.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.95) id 1st1qh-00069I-VZ for linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; Tue, 24 Sep 2024 09:28:49 +0000 Received: by verein.lst.de (Postfix, from userid 2407) id EE8A1227A8E; Tue, 24 Sep 2024 11:28:32 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2024 11:28:32 +0200 From: Christoph Hellwig To: Kanchan Joshi Message-ID: <20240924092832.GA26208@lst.de> References: <20240912130235.GB28535@lst.de> <20240913080659.GA30525@lst.de> <4a39215a-1b0e-3832-93bd-61e422705f8b@samsung.com> <20240917062007.GA4170@lst.de> <20240918064258.GA32627@lst.de> <197b2c1a-66d2-5f5a-c258-7e2f35eff8e4@samsung.com> <20240918120159.GA20658@lst.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.17 (2007-11-01) X-Headers-End: 1st1qh-00069I-VZ Subject: Re: [f2fs-dev] [PATCH v5 4/5] sd: limit to use write life hints X-BeenThere: linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: vishak.g@samsung.com, jack@suse.cz, linux-nvme@lists.infradead.org, James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com, Christoph Hellwig , sagi@grimberg.me, linux-scsi@vger.kernel.org, gost.dev@samsung.com, Nitesh Shetty , linux-block@vger.kernel.org, viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk, kbusch@kernel.org, jaegeuk@kernel.org, bvanassche@acm.org, axboe@kernel.dk, brauner@kernel.org, martin.petersen@oracle.com, jlayton@kernel.org, linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net, chuck.lever@oracle.com, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, javier.gonz@samsung.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: linux-f2fs-devel-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net On Tue, Sep 24, 2024 at 02:54:51PM +0530, Kanchan Joshi wrote: > FS managed/created hints is a different topic altogether, > and honestly > that is not the scope of this series. That needs to be thought at per-FS > level due to different data/meta layouts. No, it is not. If you design an API where hints bypass the file system you fundamentally do the wrong thing when there is a file system. No one is asking to actually implement file system support in this series, but we need to consider the fundamental problem in the API design. And yes, the actual implementation will be highly dependent on the file system. > This scope of this series is to enable application-managed hints passing > through the file system. FS only needs to pass what it receives. Which fundamentally can't work for even a semi-intelligent file system. _______________________________________________ Linux-f2fs-devel mailing list Linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/linux-f2fs-devel