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From: Kirill Korotaev <dev@sw.ru>
To: Hubertus Franke <frankeh@watson.ibm.com>
Cc: Sam Vilain <sam@vilain.net>, Rik van Riel <riel@redhat.com>,
	"Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com>,
	Kirill Korotaev <dev@openvz.org>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@osdl.org>, Andrew Morton <akpm@osdl.org>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, clg@fr.ibm.com,
	haveblue@us.ibm.com, greg@kroah.com, alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk,
	serue@us.ibm.com, arjan@infradead.org, kuznet@ms2.inr.ac.ru,
	saw@sawoct.com, devel@openvz.org, Dmitry Mishin <dim@sw.ru>
Subject: Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction
Date: Wed, 08 Feb 2006 18:36:40 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <43EA1008.5040502@sw.ru> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <43E8D160.4040803@watson.ibm.com>

> The pid-namespace (pspace) provides an approach of fully separate
> the allocation and maintenance of the pids and treating the <pspace,pid>
> tuple as an entity to uniquely identify a task and vice versa.
> As a result the logic of lookup can be pushed down the find_task_by_pid()
> lookup. There are specific cases where the init_task of a container or
> pspace needs to be checked to ensure that signals/waits and alike are 
> properly
> handled across pspace boundaries. I think this is an intuitive and clean 
> way.
> It also completely avoids the problem of having to think about all the 
> locations
> at the user/kernel boundary where a vpid/pid conversion needs to take 
> place.
> It also avoids the problems that logically vpids and pids are different 
> types and
> therefore it would have been good to have type checking automatically 
> identify
> problem spots.
> On the negative side, it does require to maintain a pidmap per pidspace.
Additional negative sides:
- full isolation can be inconvinient from containers management point of 
view. You will need to introduce new modified tools such as top/ps/kill 
and many many others. You won't be able to strace/gdb processes from the 
host also.
- overhead when virtualization is off, result is not the same.
- additional args everywhere (stack usage, etc.)

> The vpid approach has the drawbacks of having to identify the conversion 
> spots
> of all vpid vs. pid semantics. On the otherhand it does take advantage
> of the fact that no virtualization has to take place until a "container"
> has been migrated, thus rendering most of the vpid<->pid calls to be
> noops.
It has some other additional advantages:
- flexible: you can select full isolation or weak is required. I really 
believe this is very important.

> The container is just an umbrella object that ties every "virtualized" 
> subsystem
> together.
Yep. And containers were what I wanted to start with actually. Not VPIDs.

Kirill


  parent reply	other threads:[~2006-02-08 15:35 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 80+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2006-02-06 21:57 [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-06 22:12 ` [PATCH 2/4] Virtualization/containers: CONFIG_CONTAINER Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-06 22:17 ` [PATCH 3/4] Virtualization/containers: UID hash Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-06 22:22 ` [PATCH 4/4] Virtualization/containers: uts name Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-06 23:00 ` [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction Dave Hansen
2006-02-07 12:24   ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-07  3:34 ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-07  3:40   ` Rik van Riel
2006-02-07  6:30     ` Sam Vilain
2006-02-07 11:51       ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-07 14:31         ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-07 15:42       ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-07 16:18         ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-07 17:20           ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-07 22:43         ` Sam Vilain
2006-02-07 16:57       ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-07 20:19         ` Serge E. Hallyn
2006-02-07 20:46           ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-07 22:00             ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-07 22:19               ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-07 22:06             ` The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-07 23:35               ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-08  0:43                 ` Alexey Kuznetsov
2006-02-08  2:49                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-08  3:36                     ` Serge E. Hallyn
2006-02-08  3:52                       ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-08  4:37                         ` Herbert Poetzl
2006-02-08  4:46                           ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-08 19:24                         ` Stephen Hemminger
2006-02-08  5:23                 ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-08 14:40                   ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-08 15:17                     ` Serge E. Hallyn
2006-02-08 15:35                       ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-08 15:57                         ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-08 19:02                           ` Herbert Poetzl
2006-02-08 16:48                         ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-08 17:46                     ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-08 18:03                     ` Serge E. Hallyn
2006-02-08 18:31                       ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-08 20:21                       ` Dave Hansen
2006-02-08 21:22                         ` Serge E. Hallyn
2006-02-08 22:28                     ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-20 12:11                 ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-20 12:41                   ` Herbert Poetzl
2006-02-20 14:26                     ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-20 15:16                       ` Herbert Poetzl
2006-02-08  4:56               ` Herbert Poetzl
2006-02-08 14:38                 ` Serge E. Hallyn
2006-02-08 14:51                   ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-09  4:45               ` Kyle Moffett
2006-02-09  5:41                 ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-09 22:25               ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-07 22:58         ` [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction Sam Vilain
2006-02-07 23:18           ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-08  5:03             ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-08 14:13               ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-08 15:44                 ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-08 16:39                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-08  2:08           ` Kevin Fox
2006-02-08  1:16             ` Sam Vilain
2006-02-08  4:21               ` Paul Jackson
2006-02-08 15:36         ` Kirill Korotaev [this message]
2006-02-08 17:16           ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-08 20:43           ` Dave Hansen
2006-02-08 21:04             ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-07 12:14   ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-07 14:06     ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-07 14:52       ` Rik van Riel
2006-02-07 15:13         ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-09  0:24 ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-09  2:18   ` Jeff Dike
2006-02-09  3:16     ` Eric W. Biederman
2006-02-09 14:28     ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-09 15:40       ` Jeff Dike
2006-02-09 15:49         ` Kirill Korotaev
2006-02-09 17:50           ` Jeff Dike
2006-02-09 16:38     ` Hubertus Franke
2006-02-09 17:48       ` Jeff Dike
2006-02-09 22:09         ` Sam Vilain
2006-02-09 21:56   ` Eric W. Biederman

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