From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with archive (Exim 4.43) id 1NIURM-00017R-KM for mharc-grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 16:51:20 -0500 Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NIURK-00015x-8W for grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 16:51:18 -0500 Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NIURF-00013R-LD for grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 16:51:17 -0500 Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=43619 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NIURF-00013F-C2 for grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 16:51:13 -0500 Received: from mail-ew0-f209.google.com ([209.85.219.209]:54763) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NIURE-00033O-Qe for grub-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 16:51:13 -0500 Received: by ewy1 with SMTP id 1so725995ewy.8 for ; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 13:51:11 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to :x-enigmail-version:content-type; bh=wF7bFEEFJO9t9dXK5EfNJTkM/3b3z6pCzXEK04X5Ddk=; b=Mkzc/WUdnUmNi4vEVzYRozPhPbTR+p8Tvf0AiRK2JzJgcy1zPaUzF1tsBUt/M1Pl2z GJ+QNRoaoMggBaW06o5bN0miZlhAnuBp58r3LqVMTD+OhLhrn5nUmtUh08zBmcDblQq1 yQeARwJ25Uq8qMWizsE4p3YTzy5XS3ivQUd+Q= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:x-enigmail-version:content-type; b=WnMZKCO40xG/Hi19riiEw+j3zqDIa9Q0FQ1R9c9Tdc1C1+9D20NpziV2gpfZU2vUB5 9FMBVpjhtd2g//zJoLjVKE/0m4eAaQ1kZfIY215vSwy+gAmeuHwdcaUku0n0W/2VvzVu tszyrRbw2rTK9tYAZunpniYPUVev7wvxJrAdE= Received: by 10.213.0.139 with SMTP id 11mr3398792ebb.28.1260395471226; Wed, 09 Dec 2009 13:51:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from debian.bg45.phnet (gprs36.swisscom-mobile.ch [193.247.250.36]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 14sm164928ewy.7.2009.12.09.13.51.09 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Wed, 09 Dec 2009 13:51:10 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <4B201BC7.2050703@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Dec 2009 22:51:03 +0100 From: =?UTF-8?B?VmxhZGltaXIgJ8+GLWNvZGVyL3BoY29kZXInIFNlcmJpbmVua28=?= User-Agent: Mozilla-Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (X11/20091109) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: The development of GNU GRUB References: <20091207150831.GA8047@thorin> In-Reply-To: <20091207150831.GA8047@thorin> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig966527A10ECD3B58F06CCFE2" X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) Subject: Re: my plan for Multiboot 2 X-BeenThere: grub-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: The development of GNU GRUB List-Id: The development of GNU GRUB List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Dec 2009 21:51:18 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig966527A10ECD3B58F06CCFE2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Robert Millan wrote: > Hi, > > We have an obvious problem with the Multiboot 2 loader: It's in > severe bitrot. Nobody complains because nobody uses it, which is > understandable given that nobody programs for MB2, because it's not > ready (both in spec and in implementation), and we don't improve it > because nobody complains, etc. You get the point :-) > > I think the approach that was taken has proven wrong. It might have > worked with more manpower, but our time resources are scarce and we hav= e > other priorities. In my opinion, as things stand now it is best if > Multiboot 2 is developed by piggybacking on Multiboot 1 rather than as = an > isolated effort. This idea is twofold: both in spec and in implementat= ion. > > =20 Do you plan on removing multiboot2 loader from grub2 and marking multiboot2 draft as abandonded? The only major feature of multiboot2 is tagged mbi but it can be added in compatible way too. > Here's my plan for Multiboot: > > - Release Multiboot 1 as a standalone package, with no modifications.= I will > do this soon when I find some free time (and I think Vladimir had s= ome > cleanup done to the package that isn't yet merged). > =20 I'll merge it when time permits. > - Release a new revision of Multiboot 1, with only modifications that= don't > alter the spec. I.e. GRUB Legacy continues to be compliant, and we= don't > change the signature. These modifications would basically cope wit= h the > fact that Multiboot 1 is also usable on non-BIOS platforms, take ad= vantage > of modern 64-bit types to define equivalent structures, resolve som= e > ambiguities, etc. > > =20 Good points. MAny kernels can be leveraged this way to pan-i386 > - Release a new version of Multiboot 1, with only the modifications n= ecessary > for it to support non-i386 CPUs. In principle, it should be possib= le to do > this without affecting the i386 definitions. Hence GRUB Legacy con= tinues > to be compliant. > > - Make loader/i386/multiboot.c CPU-independant, to the extent that th= is is > possible. The idea is that the most amount of code that can be rea= sonably > shared, should be. > > =20 I think cpu-independency should come after possible incompatible changes since if we bring bad but compatible decision to non-x86 then it will be difficult to eradicate. I specifically want non-x86 to use only tagger multiboot header and mbi because of their expandability (we'll need it on CPUs like mips where theoretically same kernel could run on a wide range of hardware but needs a lot info for this, more than 8 features per category permit). Another problem is the difficulty to relocate non-tagged mbi. I would like eliminate this problem before going to non-x= 86 > - Release a new version of Multiboot, based on Multiboot 1, this time= > contemplating changes that break compatibility. Proposed changes m= ust > be accompanied with a patch for our loader before they're committed= to > the spec. The Multiboot 2 draft in the wiki is a good source of id= eas > for improvements, although not necessarily the only one. > > - Repeat last step untill we're satisfied with the result and can dub= it > as "Multiboot 2". > > =20 --=20 Regards Vladimir '=CF=86-coder/phcoder' Serbinenko --------------enig966527A10ECD3B58F06CCFE2 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iF4EAREKAAYFAksgG80ACgkQNak7dOguQgnYTQD/dhI6kIAQ1l5QVaGhrvbjgPE5 m/d3jbCs6I12qbxwUncBAIEOKIdUXRvg5NrQDDo+Hq4sVivngPh0lQh9TrGCKpBs =P4fX -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig966527A10ECD3B58F06CCFE2--