From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-iy0-f176.google.com (mail-iy0-f176.google.com [209.85.210.176]) by yocto-www.yoctoproject.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C9A3E00307 for ; Fri, 6 Jan 2012 15:53:18 -0800 (PST) Authentication-Results: yocto-www.yoctoproject.org; dkim=pass (1024-bit key; insecure key) header.i=@gmail.com; x-dkim-adsp=none (insecure policy) Received: by iapp10 with SMTP id p10so4506766iap.35 for ; Fri, 06 Jan 2012 15:53:18 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject :from:to:content-type; bh=+St7pgwbmIvVOexkPwQ0E/YotQdeXW0yiHJEWfikk/I=; b=tWnAXrVF63r6U6t/0w3sZhR/trfV2fxof+cp7seOdvsvomSGe5L4QgN7LWDwLOTBWH 57Y+bXwuuM4KUwalPbS+Pif8Y8JZqqJ3YwErG/W3hjYdPxpMARIlQJiOJsfE2qF8TcHc cJAQngtW5XpeippoK0jctHEKUmcW9T3rguA20= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.77.129 with SMTP id s1mr9153606igw.25.1325893997952; Fri, 06 Jan 2012 15:53:17 -0800 (PST) Sender: jefro.net@gmail.com Received: by 10.50.76.137 with HTTP; Fri, 6 Jan 2012 15:53:17 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 6 Jan 2012 15:53:17 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: F6qIBdGdgF1ckvkKSRCDeAHLhVo Message-ID: From: Jeff Osier-Mixon To: Yocto Project Subject: Does my build disk's filesystem make a difference? X-BeenThere: yocto@yoctoproject.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of all things Yocto List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Jan 2012 23:53:18 -0000 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e89a8f3bb08dc1ff1904b5e4c0f5 --e89a8f3bb08dc1ff1904b5e4c0f5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I am creating a Yocto Project build system. For various reasons, it is a dual-boot system, win7 & linux (probably mint 12, haven't decided). I have a primary boot disk with both operating systems and a large secondary disk to use for build trees etc. Does the filesystem on the big secondary disk matter? Ideally I would like to be able to get to the large data disk from both operating systems. That would necessitate NTFS, as win7 does not speak ext4 reliably, but I don't want to slow my builds down. -- Jeff Osier-Mixon http://jefro.net/blog Yocto Project Community Manager @Intel http://yoctoproject.org --e89a8f3bb08dc1ff1904b5e4c0f5 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I am creating a Yocto Project build system. For various reasons, it is a du= al-boot system, win7 & linux (probably mint 12, haven't decided). I= have a primary boot disk with both operating systems and a large secondary= disk to use for build trees etc.

Does the filesystem on the big secondary disk matter? Ideall= y I would like to be able to get to the large data disk from both operating= systems. That would necessitate NTFS, as win7 does not speak ext4 reliably= , but I don't want to slow my builds down.

--
Jeff Osier-Mixon http://jefro.net/blog
Yocto Project Community Manag= er @Intel http://yoct= oproject.org

--e89a8f3bb08dc1ff1904b5e4c0f5-- From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mga01.intel.com (mga01.intel.com [192.55.52.88]) by yocto-www.yoctoproject.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C329E00307 for ; Fri, 6 Jan 2012 16:01:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from fmsmga001.fm.intel.com ([10.253.24.23]) by fmsmga101.fm.intel.com with ESMTP; 06 Jan 2012 16:01:01 -0800 X-ExtLoop1: 1 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.71,315,1320652800"; d="scan'208";a="104415655" Received: from unknown (HELO [10.255.13.185]) ([10.255.13.185]) by fmsmga001.fm.intel.com with ESMTP; 06 Jan 2012 16:01:01 -0800 Message-ID: <4F078B3D.9020408@linux.intel.com> Date: Fri, 06 Jan 2012 16:01:01 -0800 From: Joshua Lock User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:9.0) Gecko/20111222 Thunderbird/9.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: yocto@yoctoproject.org References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: Does my build disk's filesystem make a difference? X-BeenThere: yocto@yoctoproject.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of all things Yocto List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Jan 2012 00:01:02 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 06/01/12 15:53, Jeff Osier-Mixon wrote: > I am creating a Yocto Project build system. For various reasons, it is a > dual-boot system, win7 & linux (probably mint 12, haven't decided). I > have a primary boot disk with both operating systems and a large > secondary disk to use for build trees etc. > > Does the filesystem on the big secondary disk matter? Ideally I would > like to be able to get to the large data disk from both operating > systems. That would necessitate NTFS, as win7 does not speak ext4 > reliably, but I don't want to slow my builds down. Erk! I'm not familiar with NTFS but the thought of this scares me, I expect you'd be opening yourself up to a world of hurt as: a) NTFS isn't a first class citizen of Linux. b) according to wikipedia NTFS has a 255 character filename limit - I don't know for certain this is a problem but I wouldn't be surprised if it is. Will you be storing anything on the disk that isn't build related? If you anticipate doing a lot of builds you really want to a) use a filesystem that is Linux native and b) tweak the filesystem to reduce the number of writes made. If you just want/need to be able to look at the build system pieces under WinOS then you could try: http://www.ext2fsd.com/ Cheers, Joshua -- Joshua Lock Yocto Project "Johannes factotum" Intel Open Source Technology Centre From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mga14.intel.com (mga14.intel.com [143.182.124.37]) by yocto-www.yoctoproject.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DAB3E00307 for ; Fri, 6 Jan 2012 17:50:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from azsmga001.ch.intel.com ([10.2.17.19]) by azsmga102.ch.intel.com with ESMTP; 06 Jan 2012 17:50:31 -0800 X-ExtLoop1: 1 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.71,315,1320652800"; d="scan'208";a="93300794" Received: from unknown (HELO envy.home) ([10.255.13.98]) by azsmga001.ch.intel.com with ESMTP; 06 Jan 2012 17:50:29 -0800 Message-ID: <4F07A4D2.5010800@linux.intel.com> Date: Fri, 06 Jan 2012 17:50:10 -0800 From: Darren Hart User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:7.0) Gecko/20110927 Thunderbird/7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Joshua Lock References: <4F078B3D.9020408@linux.intel.com> In-Reply-To: <4F078B3D.9020408@linux.intel.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.3.3 Cc: yocto@yoctoproject.org Subject: Re: Does my build disk's filesystem make a difference? X-BeenThere: yocto@yoctoproject.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of all things Yocto List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Jan 2012 01:50:32 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 01/06/2012 04:01 PM, Joshua Lock wrote: > On 06/01/12 15:53, Jeff Osier-Mixon wrote: >> I am creating a Yocto Project build system. For various reasons, it is a >> dual-boot system, win7 & linux (probably mint 12, haven't decided). I >> have a primary boot disk with both operating systems and a large >> secondary disk to use for build trees etc. >> >> Does the filesystem on the big secondary disk matter? Ideally I would Yes, it matters a great deal. Many of the features we use to ensure data integrity and accounting slow down performance. I use a separate ext4 RAID 0 array for builds (and only for builds and other data that can be easily recreated). I mount it without a journal and with noatime. This significantly reduces the overhead of the filesystem and increases performance considerably - at the cost of higher risk of data loss in the event of an unclean shutdown. >> like to be able to get to the large data disk from both operating >> systems. That would necessitate NTFS, as win7 does not speak ext4 >> reliably, but I don't want to slow my builds down. No way. See below for details. > > Erk! I'm not familiar with NTFS but the thought of this scares me, I > expect you'd be opening yourself up to a world of hurt as: > > a) NTFS isn't a first class citizen of Linux. > b) according to wikipedia NTFS has a 255 character filename limit - I > don't know for certain this is a problem but I wouldn't be surprised if > it is. In kernel NTFS only has experimental write support, and only to overwrite existing files without changing their file size. NTFS-3G provides a userspace filesystem implementation with more features, but I'd bet my house on the performance being abysmal for builds. -- Darren > > Will you be storing anything on the disk that isn't build related? If > you anticipate doing a lot of builds you really want to a) use a > filesystem that is Linux native and b) tweak the filesystem to reduce > the number of writes made. > > If you just want/need to be able to look at the build system pieces > under WinOS then you could try: > http://www.ext2fsd.com/ > > Cheers, > Joshua -- Darren Hart Intel Open Source Technology Center Yocto Project - Linux Kernel From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mail-vx0-f176.google.com (mail-vx0-f176.google.com [209.85.220.176]) by yocto-www.yoctoproject.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C187E006B5 for ; Sat, 7 Jan 2012 07:16:15 -0800 (PST) Authentication-Results: yocto-www.yoctoproject.org; dkim=pass (1024-bit key; insecure key) header.i=@gmail.com; x-dkim-adsp=none (insecure policy) Received: by vcbfl13 with SMTP id fl13so2493087vcb.35 for ; Sat, 07 Jan 2012 07:16:14 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=Yco4vf+0i62XxRioAlR2v5rSs4Z7FpgrdgpUPAlHSSE=; b=wBszLv9baEdWneP/YWJeJQjEWoL9ItjpfKjrnr0banvRWVBHjlWPCkm9Ak2HuUa/3d 4ZyrzJRrQ2pVZTnwU8Tn0YIBHmOfzzJzluZGCG4AWapcqpWPl6/+byUPJogoNU6KKVQ7 XEJxBBMCjjwWdzRK0+jfX/DRWtS5vtYRqj+bM= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.220.149.135 with SMTP id t7mr5859561vcv.34.1325949374602; Sat, 07 Jan 2012 07:16:14 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.52.159.9 with HTTP; Sat, 7 Jan 2012 07:16:14 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2012 10:16:14 -0500 Message-ID: From: autif khan To: Jeff Osier-Mixon Cc: Yocto Project Subject: Re: Does my build disk's filesystem make a difference? X-BeenThere: yocto@yoctoproject.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of all things Yocto List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Jan 2012 15:16:15 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 You are better off with one of the dual boot OSes in a virtual machine that a dual boot situation where you are trying to write to NTFS from linux or trying to work with ext2fs tools from windows. I do not even know if you can create equivalent of symlinks (used extensively in yocto) on an NTFS In theory, it might work, but NTFS was not built for linux, likewise, ext4 was not meant to be used for windows. It is a bad idea. You know - unless this happens to be your master's research thesis :-) On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 6:53 PM, Jeff Osier-Mixon wrote: > I am creating a Yocto Project build system. For various reasons, it is a > dual-boot system, win7 & linux (probably mint 12, haven't decided). I have a > primary boot disk with both operating systems and a large secondary disk to > use for build trees etc. > > Does the filesystem on the big secondary disk matter? Ideally I would like > to be able to get to the large data disk from both operating systems. That > would necessitate NTFS, as win7 does not speak ext4 reliably, but I don't > want to slow my builds down. > > -- > Jeff Osier-Mixon http://jefro.net/blog > Yocto Project Community Manager @Intel http://yoctoproject.org > > > _______________________________________________ > yocto mailing list > yocto@yoctoproject.org > https://lists.yoctoproject.org/listinfo/yocto > From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from tinyArch.localdomain (unknown [78.110.170.148]) by yocto-www.yoctoproject.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E4F7E0121A for ; Mon, 9 Jan 2012 01:16:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.21] (unknown [195.171.99.130]) by tinyArch.localdomain (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A96EE21B85 for ; Mon, 9 Jan 2012 08:45:43 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <4F0AB04C.2060304@communistcode.co.uk> Date: Mon, 09 Jan 2012 09:15:56 +0000 From: Jack Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:9.0) Gecko/20111224 Thunderbird/9.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "yocto@yoctoproject.org" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: Does my build disk's filesystem make a difference? X-BeenThere: yocto@yoctoproject.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion of all things Yocto List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Jan 2012 09:16:47 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 07/01/12 15:16, autif khan wrote: > You are better off with one of the dual boot OSes in a virtual machine > that a dual boot situation where you are trying to write to NTFS from > linux or trying to work with ext2fs tools from windows. > > I do not even know if you can create equivalent of symlinks (used > extensively in yocto) on an NTFS > > In theory, it might work, but NTFS was not built for linux, likewise, > ext4 was not meant to be used for windows. It is a bad idea. > > You know - unless this happens to be your master's research thesis :-) > > On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 6:53 PM, Jeff Osier-Mixon wrote: >> I am creating a Yocto Project build system. For various reasons, it is a >> dual-boot system, win7& linux (probably mint 12, haven't decided). I have a >> primary boot disk with both operating systems and a large secondary disk to >> use for build trees etc. >> >> Does the filesystem on the big secondary disk matter? Ideally I would like >> to be able to get to the large data disk from both operating systems. That >> would necessitate NTFS, as win7 does not speak ext4 reliably, but I don't >> want to slow my builds down. >> >> -- >> Jeff Osier-Mixon http://jefro.net/blog >> Yocto Project Community Manager @Intel http://yoctoproject.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> yocto mailing list >> yocto@yoctoproject.org >> https://lists.yoctoproject.org/listinfo/yocto >> > _______________________________________________ > yocto mailing list > yocto@yoctoproject.org > https://lists.yoctoproject.org/listinfo/yocto I'm no expert in this either but I am unsure how NTFS handles file permissions, something else that could horribly break! If I were you I would do as suggested earlier and run Win7 in a virtual machine then use a shared directory/network shares system. Otherwise, you could format as ext3 and use the 3rd party drivers available to Windows for reading. Again though I don't know how permissions are handled or anything like that so it may be ok for browsing but I wouldn't recommend major changes through it. Jack.