From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Ray Wells Subject: Re: Node.js and it's future in debian Date: Fri, 04 May 2012 14:28:41 +1000 Message-ID: <4FA35AF9.6020508@exemail.com.au> References: <20120501205524.GI30521@flying-gecko.net> <20120501215305.GA1250@burratino> <20120501221659.GA11430@flying-gecko.net> <20120502065003.GB2410@burratino> <20120502165031.GC7390@flying-gecko.net> <20120502171349.GA23806@burratino> <20120502200426.GF7390@flying-gecko.net> <4FA2A557.1080103@trinnet.net> <20120503170521.GD19468@flying-gecko.net> <20120503185129.GA18768@burratino> <4FA3567F.2020707@trinnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-path: In-Reply-To: <4FA3567F.2020707@trinnet.net> Sender: linux-hams-owner@vger.kernel.org List-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format="flowed" To: David Ranch Cc: Jonathan Nieder , Patrick Ouellette , node@packages.debian.org, nodejs@packages.debian.org, debian-hams@lists.debian.org, linux-hams@vger.kernel.org All, Although not currently running a node (although I do run aprs with kernel ax25), I started using kernel ax25 back around 1994 (ish) with a floppy that booted into ramdisk and provided two ports, one kiss and the other baycom. I used node back then but moved on. The disk still works but I can't for the life of me remember the logon password :-( Back then (kernel 2.0.29) it was ax25-utils- that provided kernel ax25 apps and tools, in the days prior to ax25-apps and ax25-tools being released as separate packages. When I last ran a node, along with a bbs, I didn't use the node package. Instead, I used fpac which provided the facilities I needed - ax25, rose and netrom. For many, many years, right up to just last week, I compile libax25, ax25-apps & ax25-tools from sources to try to keep as up to date as possible with fixes, etc. Although not a user of the packages I still appreciate the efforts of the maintainers who produce packages for the benefit of users/potential users who don't care to compile from sources. As for a name change for node, it seems strange that such a long-running application should be forced to change simply because of some Johnny-come-lately. I think Debian policy in this regard should be reviewed to prevent repetition of the current stalemate in the years to come. FWIW, I've only ever used Debian or a Debian derivative. Ray vk2tv On 04/05/12 14:09, David Ranch wrote: > > Me again.. > > AX.25 in Linux has been around for a long time so I can excuse it's > overly generic "node" name purely based upon it's age but.. > > >> The working title of Node.js was "server" for a few weeks, before >> anyone was using it. > > Wow.. that's horrible! Obviously we don't want stuff like that to > happen. Please also consider that all this ISN'T just a *Debian* > problem. Its a Linux distro-wide problem. It's groups like this that > form and guide aspects of all Linux distributions consistency and > considering Debian's wide influence, changes here will surely trickle > into other distributions over time. > > It's also worth touching on that I personally appreciate the work that > Patrick Ouellette has done on maintaining the HAM packages for Debian. > Like always, there are never enough appreciative people in this world > but once removed / renamed /etc, I'm SURE a lot of people will come > out of the woodwork to bitch about it. A *lot* of people use Debian > and Debian-related distributions with Packet radio. > > >> 1. Which package should use the name "node" in the long term? What >> can we do to ensure that happens eventually? >> >> (My answer is that I hope that neither uses the name "node" in >> the long term.) > > I personally think that some of it SHOULD be a first come, first > served thing. I previously mentioned in the previous email that all > of the various scripts that people run could/would break. Probably no > big deal to many of us on *this* list but trust me, I know a few Linux > packet people who would be seriously lost because of these changes. > > Also consider the tons of documentation, notably the AX.25 HOWTO that > would be impacted and I highly doubt it would get updated (hasn't been > since 2001) to reflect these changes. It's not like things have > needed to change all that much - http://tldp.org/HOWTO/AX25-HOWTO/ > > >> 2. What should be the state in Debian's upcoming "wheezy" release to >> provide a smooth upgrade path and not surprise users too much? > > Is Node.js a new addition to Debian? Again, I side with first come > first served. > > >> I also would hope that wheezy can include a /usr/sbin/node file >> that prints a message to help people notice they are still using >> it and calls /usr/sbin/axnode, but that is still under discussion. >> >> Likewise, the Node.js needs some migration to ensure scripts >> installed by Debian packages and from outside use the new name. >> I would hope that wheezy can include a /usr/bin/node synonym for >> compatibility until usage of it fades away, but that is still >> under discussion.) > > If for some reason Debian feels that longstanding packages and their > well known binary names can be renamed at any given time (I seriously > disagree with that mentality btw), I'd say then ALSO force the change > of the "node" in Node.JS name to something more sane. Don't remove > one poorly named file for a new poorly named one just because it's new > and shiny. > > --David > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-hams" in > the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org > More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html >