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From: "Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)" <mtk.manpages-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
To: Davidlohr Bueso <dave-h16yJtLeMjHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org>,
	Peter Zijlstra <peterz-wEGCiKHe2LqWVfeAwA7xHQ@public.gmane.org>
Cc: mtk.manpages-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org,
	Thomas Gleixner <tglx-hfZtesqFncYOwBW4kG4KsQ@public.gmane.org>,
	Darren Hart <dvhart-VuQAYsv1563Yd54FQh9/CA@public.gmane.org>,
	Carlos O'Donell <carlos-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>,
	Ingo Molnar <mingo-X9Un+BFzKDI@public.gmane.org>,
	Jakub Jelinek <jakub-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>,
	"linux-man-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org"
	<linux-man-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>,
	lkml <linux-kernel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>,
	Arnd Bergmann <arnd-r2nGTMty4D4@public.gmane.org>,
	Steven Rostedt <rostedt-nx8X9YLhiw1AfugRpC6u6w@public.gmane.org>,
	Linux API <linux-api-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>,
	Torvald Riegel <triegel-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>,
	Roland McGrath <roland-/Z5OmTQCD9xF6kxbq+BtvQ@public.gmane.org>,
	Darren Hart <dvhart-wEGCiKHe2LqWVfeAwA7xHQ@public.gmane.org>,
	Anton Blanchard <anton-eUNUBHrolfbYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org>,
	Eric Dumazet <edumazet-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>,
	bill o gallmeister
	<bgallmeister-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>,
	Jan Kiszka <jan.kiszka-kv7WeFo6aLtBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org>,
	Daniel Wagner <wagi-kQCPcA+X3s7YtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org>,
	Rich Felker <dalias-8zAoT0mYgF4@public.gmane.org>,
	Andy Lutomirski <luto-kltTT9wpgjJwATOyAt5JVQ@public.gmane.org>,
	bert hubert <bert.hubert-dxZxOz86jR8sYtaaK7K+xw@public.gmane.org>,
	Rusty Russell <rusty-8n+1lVoiYb80n/F98K4Iww@public.gmane.org>,
	Heinrich Schuchardt <xypron>
Subject: Re: Revised futex(2) man page for review
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2015 13:00:50 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <55B60F62.6010303@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1427834205.20009.19.camel-h16yJtLeMjHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org>

Hi David,

On 03/31/2015 10:36 PM, Davidlohr Bueso wrote:
> On Sat, 2015-03-28 at 13:03 +0100, Peter Zijlstra wrote:
>>>               If the timeout argument is non-NULL, its contents specify a rel‐
>>>               ative   timeout   for   the  wait,  measured  according  to  the
>>>               CLOCK_MONOTONIC clock.  (This interval will be rounded up to the
>>>               system clock granularity, and kernel scheduling delays mean that
>>>               the blocking interval may overrun by a small amount.)  If  time‐
>>>               out is NULL, the call blocks indefinitely.
>>
>> Would it not be better to only state that the wait will not return
>> before the timeout -- unless woken -- and not bother with clock
>> granularity and scheduling delays?
> 
> Yeah, similarly we also have this:
> 
>      FUTEX_PRIVATE_FLAG (since Linux 2.6.22)
>               This option bit can be employed with all futex  operations.   It
>               tells  the  kernel  that  the  futex  is process-private and not
>               shared with another process (i.e., it is  only  being  used  for
>               synchronization  between  threads  of  the  same process).  This
>               allows the kernel to choose the fast  path  for  validating  the
>               user-space address and avoids expensive VMA lookups, taking ref‐
>               erence counts on file backing store, and so on.
> 
> This to me reads a bit too much into the kernel (fastpath, refcnt,
> vmas). Why not just mention that it avoids overhead in the kernel or
> something? I don't recall any manpage mentioning such details, but I
> could be wrong. 

Thanks. Agreed. I changed this to

    This allows the kernel to make some additional performance optimizations.

> In any case its a nit, the whole doc is pretty good and
> I hope you can merge it soon and then just increment ;)

I ran out of time and energy at a certain point. And also got a little
disheartened that I got more people complaining about groff markup
than actually looked looked at the FIXMEs in the page source :-). 
I'll try to reboot the process.

Cheers,

Michael


-- 
Michael Kerrisk
Linux man-pages maintainer; http://www.kernel.org/doc/man-pages/
Linux/UNIX System Programming Training: http://man7.org/training/

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: "Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)" <mtk.manpages@gmail.com>
To: Davidlohr Bueso <dave@stgolabs.net>,
	Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>
Cc: mtk.manpages@gmail.com, Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>,
	Darren Hart <dvhart@linux.intel.com>,
	"Carlos O'Donell" <carlos@redhat.com>,
	Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu>, Jakub Jelinek <jakub@redhat.com>,
	"linux-man@vger.kernel.org" <linux-man@vger.kernel.org>,
	lkml <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	Arnd Bergmann <arnd@arndb.de>,
	Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org>,
	Linux API <linux-api@vger.kernel.org>,
	Torvald Riegel <triegel@redhat.com>,
	Roland McGrath <roland@hack.frob.com>,
	Darren Hart <dvhart@infradead.org>,
	Anton Blanchard <anton@samba.org>,
	Eric Dumazet <edumazet@google.com>,
	bill o gallmeister <bgallmeister@gmail.com>,
	Jan Kiszka <jan.kiszka@siemens.com>,
	Daniel Wagner <wagi@monom.org>, Rich Felker <dalias@libc.org>,
	Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net>,
	bert hubert <bert.hubert@netherlabs.nl>,
	Rusty Russell <rusty@rustcorp.com.au>,
	Heinrich Schuchardt <xypron.glpk@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: Revised futex(2) man page for review
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 2015 13:00:50 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <55B60F62.6010303@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1427834205.20009.19.camel@stgolabs.net>

Hi David,

On 03/31/2015 10:36 PM, Davidlohr Bueso wrote:
> On Sat, 2015-03-28 at 13:03 +0100, Peter Zijlstra wrote:
>>>               If the timeout argument is non-NULL, its contents specify a rel‐
>>>               ative   timeout   for   the  wait,  measured  according  to  the
>>>               CLOCK_MONOTONIC clock.  (This interval will be rounded up to the
>>>               system clock granularity, and kernel scheduling delays mean that
>>>               the blocking interval may overrun by a small amount.)  If  time‐
>>>               out is NULL, the call blocks indefinitely.
>>
>> Would it not be better to only state that the wait will not return
>> before the timeout -- unless woken -- and not bother with clock
>> granularity and scheduling delays?
> 
> Yeah, similarly we also have this:
> 
>      FUTEX_PRIVATE_FLAG (since Linux 2.6.22)
>               This option bit can be employed with all futex  operations.   It
>               tells  the  kernel  that  the  futex  is process-private and not
>               shared with another process (i.e., it is  only  being  used  for
>               synchronization  between  threads  of  the  same process).  This
>               allows the kernel to choose the fast  path  for  validating  the
>               user-space address and avoids expensive VMA lookups, taking ref‐
>               erence counts on file backing store, and so on.
> 
> This to me reads a bit too much into the kernel (fastpath, refcnt,
> vmas). Why not just mention that it avoids overhead in the kernel or
> something? I don't recall any manpage mentioning such details, but I
> could be wrong. 

Thanks. Agreed. I changed this to

    This allows the kernel to make some additional performance optimizations.

> In any case its a nit, the whole doc is pretty good and
> I hope you can merge it soon and then just increment ;)

I ran out of time and energy at a certain point. And also got a little
disheartened that I got more people complaining about groff markup
than actually looked looked at the FIXMEs in the page source :-). 
I'll try to reboot the process.

Cheers,

Michael


-- 
Michael Kerrisk
Linux man-pages maintainer; http://www.kernel.org/doc/man-pages/
Linux/UNIX System Programming Training: http://man7.org/training/

  parent reply	other threads:[~2015-07-27 11:00 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 44+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-03-28  8:53 Revised futex(2) man page for review Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-03-28  8:53 ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found] ` <55166C01.7000803-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2015-03-28  8:56   ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-03-28  8:56     ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-03-28 11:47   ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-03-28 11:47     ` Peter Zijlstra
     [not found]     ` <20150328114725.GJ27490-IIpfhp3q70z/8w/KjCw3T+5/BudmfyzbbVWyRVo5IupeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org>
2015-03-28 12:03       ` Peter Zijlstra
2015-03-28 12:03         ` Peter Zijlstra
     [not found]         ` <20150328120337.GB32047-IIpfhp3q70xoDWY/xQGDymt3HXsI98Cx0E9HWUfgJXw@public.gmane.org>
2015-03-31 20:36           ` Davidlohr Bueso
2015-03-31 20:36             ` Davidlohr Bueso
     [not found]             ` <1427834205.20009.19.camel-h16yJtLeMjHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org>
2015-07-27 11:00               ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages) [this message]
2015-07-27 11:00                 ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-27 11:10         ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-27 11:10           ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-03-31 14:45       ` Davidlohr Bueso
2015-03-31 14:45         ` Davidlohr Bueso
     [not found]         ` <1427813146.20009.2.camel-h16yJtLeMjHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org>
2015-07-27 11:10           ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-27 11:10             ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]             ` <55B611B3.7030005-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2015-07-28  3:16               ` Davidlohr Bueso
2015-07-28  3:16                 ` Davidlohr Bueso
     [not found]                 ` <1438053377.2249.25.camel-h16yJtLeMjHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org>
2015-07-28  7:44                   ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-28  7:44                     ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
     [not found]                     ` <55B732C6.9080905-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2015-07-28 17:52                       ` Davidlohr Bueso
2015-07-28 17:52                         ` Davidlohr Bueso
     [not found]                         ` <1438105974.2249.67.camel-h16yJtLeMjHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org>
2015-07-28 18:09                           ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-28 18:09                             ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-04-14 21:40       ` Thomas Gleixner
2015-04-14 21:40         ` Thomas Gleixner
2015-04-15 10:28         ` Torvald Riegel
2015-04-15 10:28           ` Torvald Riegel
     [not found]           ` <1429093725.2909.29.camel-I2ZjUw8blINjztcc/or7kQ@public.gmane.org>
2015-07-27 11:10             ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-27 11:10               ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-04-27 20:37       ` Pavel Machek
2015-04-27 20:37         ` Pavel Machek
2015-07-27 11:10         ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-27 11:10           ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-28  2:52       ` Davidlohr Bueso
2015-07-28  2:52         ` Davidlohr Bueso
     [not found]         ` <1438051964.2249.9.camel-h16yJtLeMjHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org>
2015-07-28  6:39           ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-28  6:39             ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-03-31  1:48   ` Rusty Russell
2015-03-31  1:48     ` Rusty Russell
     [not found]     ` <871tk6os1y.fsf-8n+1lVoiYb80n/F98K4Iww@public.gmane.org>
2015-07-27 11:03       ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)
2015-07-27 11:03         ` Michael Kerrisk (man-pages)

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