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Tue, 26 May 2026 23:17:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from draig.lan ([185.124.0.195]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-4904526c926sm669073835e9.1.2026.05.26.23.17.25 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 26 May 2026 23:17:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from draig (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by draig.lan (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6109A5F81C; Wed, 27 May 2026 07:17:24 +0100 (BST) From: =?utf-8?Q?Alex_Benn=C3=A9e?= To: Pierrick Bouvier Cc: qemu-devel@nongnu.org, Peter Xu , Daniel P. =?utf-8?Q?Berrang=C3=A9?= , Thomas Huth , Song Gao , John Snow , Philippe =?utf-8?Q?Mathieu-Daud=C3=A9?= , Kyle Evans , Pierrick Bouvier , Cleber Rosa , Warner Losh , Brad Smith , Thomas Huth , Paolo Bonzini , Max Filippov , Brian Cain , Fabiano Rosas , Peter Maydell , Richard Henderson , qemu-arm@nongnu.org Subject: Re: [PATCH v2 03/16] tests/Makefile.include: add binary dependency to run-tcg-tests-% rules In-Reply-To: <8a878679-733c-451c-8053-663a74f8d4a7@oss.qualcomm.com> (Pierrick Bouvier's message of "Tue, 26 May 2026 11:07:50 -0700") References: <20260521131739.540157-1-alex.bennee@linaro.org> <20260521131739.540157-4-alex.bennee@linaro.org> <74e8bc86-cd81-43f9-b5cb-7e3de3bcd3d0@oss.qualcomm.com> <87tsrzl138.fsf@draig.linaro.org> <093614fb-ced1-4b15-b1e1-5da755f87237@oss.qualcomm.com> <87cxymec7b.fsf@draig.linaro.org> <5bd51a1a-4079-4073-bbd8-f0206a1ad458@oss.qualcomm.com> <0f73d717-1621-4c3f-9c5e-9bfdfaffb0b8@oss.qualcomm.com> <877bor9vor.fsf@draig.linaro.org> <7d58926d-a36d-430f-828e-7ebdd9cc4eb5@oss.qualcomm.com> <87qzmyzbut.fsf@draig.linaro.org> <06092208-1b56-4fea-8d92-bf035fbd0fa3@oss.qualcomm.com> <87fr3eyrvp.fsf@draig.linaro.org> <8a878679-733c-451c-8053-663a74f8d4a7@oss.qualcomm.com> User-Agent: mu4e 1.14.1; emacs 30.1 Date: Wed, 27 May 2026 07:17:24 +0100 Message-ID: <87a4tlz897.fsf@draig.linaro.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::334; envelope-from=alex.bennee@linaro.org; helo=mail-wm1-x334.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: qemu-arm@nongnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: qemu-arm-bounces+qemu-arm=archiver.kernel.org@nongnu.org Sender: qemu-arm-bounces+qemu-arm=archiver.kernel.org@nongnu.org Pierrick Bouvier writes: > On 5/26/2026 10:58 AM, Alex Benn=C3=A9e wrote: >> Pierrick Bouvier writes: >>=20 >>> On 5/26/2026 3:47 AM, Alex Benn=C3=A9e wrote: >>>> Pierrick Bouvier writes: >>>> >>>>> On 5/25/2026 11:43 AM, Alex Benn=C3=A9e wrote: >>>>>> Pierrick Bouvier writes: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 5/25/2026 8:46 AM, Pierrick Bouvier wrote: >>>>>>>> On 5/23/2026 1:56 AM, Alex Benn=C3=A9e wrote: >>>>>>>>> Pierrick Bouvier writes: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 5/22/2026 12:02 PM, Alex Benn=C3=A9e wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Pierrick Bouvier writes: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On 5/21/2026 6:17 AM, Alex Benn=C3=A9e wrote: >>> >>> We'll need to remove the mechanic to build cross compilers containers. >>> In my experience, it's clunky anyway and fails when building several >>> from scratch. Try it yourself after cleaning your docker/podman images. >>> It's just better and simpler to expect user to install cross >>> compilers. >>=20 >> That would loose a bunch of functionality and doesn't help users running >> anything that isn't Debian. >> > > Out of fedora, who does it exclude? RHEL, CentOS, SuSE The cross compiler situation may have improved since - Debian has always been ahead of the curve in its multi-arch support. > We can still provide a fat debian container with all cross compilers > embedded for people who don't run ubuntu/debian. > >>> The only thing that prevented me to implement this before is that I >>> didn't know if concerned maintainers would accept it, or just hold onto >>> the precious handcrafted Makefiles, into which so much energy and time >>> has been spent. >>=20 >> There is no desire to hold onto Makefiles, but I do want to keep the >> same capabilities as the current system. The driver for containerising >> the compilers was that setting up cross compilers is a barrier to >> contributors who want to be able to add and build tests. >> > > Personally, this "smart" layer has been a barrier even on Debian, since > by default it tries to build them, and it fails from scratch. > Give it a try by purging your docker images, and run a make check-tcg > -j$(nproc). I doubt anyone is really running check-tcg with this in real > life. What do you mean? I run check-tcg all the time. Which containers fail to build for you? The main cross-compiler one (debian-all-test-cross) is built all the time. > But well, if the cross-container thing is *really* a blocker, we can > just wrap build and run in a script per cross compiler, that does > docker/podman build && docker/podman run and call that. We still have the remnants of that in the docker.py script although for most containers we moved to invoking docker (or podman) directly. Also bear in mind the containers are also used to cross build QEMU itself.=20 > > Now we solved the problem with system tests, and cross compilers, is > there another thing that is absolutely needed from Makefiles? > >>> If it's not the case, then we should definitely move into the direction >>> of migrating all this to meson, and rely on meson tests infrastructure. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Pierrick >>=20 --=20 Alex Benn=C3=A9e Virtualisation Tech Lead @ Linaro