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Fri, 13 Nov 2026 05:20:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from draig.lan ([185.124.0.158]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-49c60116323sm5076828f8f.32.2026.11.13.05.20.56 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 13 Nov 2026 05:20:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from draig (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by draig.lan (Postfix) with ESMTP id 685315F87D; Fri, 13 Nov 2026 13:20:55 +0000 (GMT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Alex_Benn=C3=A9e?= To: Daniel P. =?utf-8?Q?Berrang=C3=A9?= Cc: =?utf-8?Q?Marc-Andr=C3=A9?= Lureau , Thomas Huth , qemu-devel@nongnu.org, qemu-arm@nongnu.org, Peter Maydell , Paolo Bonzini , qemu-ppc@nongnu.org, qemu-block@nongnu.org, qemu-riscv@nongnu.org, qemu-s390x@nongnu.org Subject: Re: [PATCH v2 04/28] hw: mark all remaining virtio object types as secure In-Reply-To: ("Daniel P. =?utf-8?Q?Berrang?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=A9=22's?= message of "Fri, 13 Nov 2026 11:33:57 +0000") References: <20261029131241.2275706-1-berrange@redhat.com> <20261029131241.2275706-5-berrange@redhat.com> <87ik21asn4.fsf@draig.linaro.org> User-Agent: mu4e 1.14.5-pre1; emacs 30.1 Date: Fri, 13 Nov 2026 13:20:55 +0000 Message-ID: <87cxs8c1fs.fsf@draig.linaro.org> X-Archived-By: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::430; envelope-from=alex.bennee@linaro.org; helo=mail-wr1-x430.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: qemu-arm@nongnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: qemu-arm-bounces+qemu-arm=archiver.kernel.org@nongnu.org X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.8 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, INCLUDES_CR_TRAILER,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=4.0.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 4.0.1 (2024-03-26) on aws-us-west-2-korg-listserv-alma10-1 Daniel P. Berrang=C3=A9 writes: > On Fri, Nov 13, 2026 at 11:16:15AM +0000, Alex Benn=C3=A9e wrote: >> Daniel P. Berrang=C3=A9 writes: >>=20 >> > Alex, as the virtio-gpu* maintainer can you give your opinion >> > on the discussion below about virtio-gpu security tagging >> > vs our current security policy for "virtualization use case" >> > to ack/nack the proposal. >>=20 >> I'm inclined to agree with Marc-Andre here - the 3D GPU attack surface >> is large and for the in-QEMU handling we have a bunch of issues with GPU >> context handling between threads that make it tricky. Compounding that >> ruttabaga is not very well tested at all because its hard to enable >> without non-distro libs (for now). >>=20 >> Finally virtio-gpu is Odd Fixes so it's not getting the response times >> of other VirtIO stuff in terms of handling security issues. >>=20 >> We should encourage users to use vhost-user-gpu for 3D stuff because at >> least then the rendering pipeline and processing of guest controlled >> data is easier to sandbox. >>=20 >> So I'd say: >>=20 >> - virtio-gpu for 2d - OK >> - virtio-gpu for 3d via vhost - OK >> - virtio-gpu for 3d in QEMU - Not OK > > So, IIUC, in terms of what -device help reports, that would mean > > Secure: > > name "vhost-user-gpu", bus virtio-bus > name "vhost-user-gpu-pci", bus PCI > name "virtio-gpu-device", bus virtio-bus > name "virtio-gpu-pci", bus PCI, alias "virtio-gpu" and virtio-vga > > Not secure: > > name "virtio-gpu-gl-device", bus virtio-bus > name "virtio-gpu-gl-pci", bus PCI, alias "virtio-gpu-gl" > name "virtio-gpu-rutabaga-device", bus virtio-bus > name "virtio-gpu-rutabaga-pci", bus PCI, alias "virtio-gpu-rutabaga" > and virtio-vga-gl > ? Looks good to me. > >>=20=20=20 >> Alex. >>=20 >> > >> > On Fri, Nov 06, 2026 at 05:33:31PM +0000, Daniel P. Berrang=C3=A9 wrot= e: >> >> On Fri, Nov 06, 2026 at 06:52:27PM +0400, Marc-Andr=C3=A9 Lureau wrot= e: >> >> > Hi >> >> >=20 >> >> > On Fri, Nov 6, 2026 at 6:40=E2=80=AFPM Daniel P. Berrang=C3=A9 wrote: >> >> > > >> >> > > On Fri, Nov 06, 2026 at 06:35:29PM +0400, Marc-Andr=C3=A9 Lureau = wrote: >> >> > > > Hi >> >> > > > >> >> > > > On Fri, Nov 6, 2026 at 3:53=E2=80=AFPM Thomas Huth wrote: >> >> > > > > >> >> > > > > On 29/10/2026 14.12, Daniel P. Berrang=C3=A9 wrote: >> >> > > > > > These are all intended for use in a virtualization scenario= and must >> >> > > > > > provide a security boundary. >> >> > > > > > >> >> > > > > > Acked-by: Marc-Andr=C3=A9 Lureau >> >> > > > > > Signed-off-by: Daniel P. Berrang=C3=A9 >> >> > > > > > --- >> >> > > > > Reviewed-by: Thomas Huth >> >> > > > > >> >> > > > >> >> > > > I have a second thought about this, I'd like to exclude all >> >> > > > gpu-accelerated paths for now. virgl/mesa/rutabaga expose a ver= y large >> >> > > > attack surface, so I'd like to drop them from the secure bounda= ry >> >> > > >> >> > > Rather than repost, please see my response for patch 2: >> >> > > >> >> > > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/qemu-devel/2026-11/msg01530.= html >> >> > > >> >> > > TL;DR: we have already promised anything virtio related is in sco= pe >> >> > > for security handling for a long time, as they are all unambiguou= sly >> >> > > "virtualization use case". >> >> > > >> >> >=20 >> >> > the value of a secure policy enforcement is low if we know those >> >> > devices are unsecure and don't have the resources to make them secu= re. >> >>=20 >> >> It isn't a great situation to be in, but we're already there for any >> >> virtio devices based on our existing policies for bug handling and >> >> security triage. We can't promise we'll get fixes for all CVEs quickl= y, >> >> but we will at least assign CVEs so that users are aware when there >> >> are known problems. >> >>=20 >> >> This contrasts to other devices where problems will remain largely >> >> hidden for view, as we treat them as normal bugs and never call our >> >> security concerns when committing changes. >> >>=20 >> >> With regards, >> >> Daniel >> >> --=20 >> >> |: https://berrange.com ~~ https://hachyderm.io/@berrang= e :| >> >> |: https://libvirt.org ~~ https://entangle-photo.or= g :| >> >> |: https://pixelfed.art/berrange ~~ https://fstop138.berrange.co= m :| >> >>=20 >> >>=20 >> > >> > With regards, >> > Daniel >>=20 >> --=20 >> Alex Benn=C3=A9e >> Virtualisation Tech Lead @ Linaro >>=20 > > With regards, > Daniel --=20 Alex Benn=C3=A9e Virtualisation Tech Lead @ Linaro