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From: Markus Armbruster <armbru@redhat.com>
To: "Daniel P. Berrangé" <berrange@redhat.com>
Cc: "Peter Maydell" <peter.maydell@linaro.org>,
	"John Snow" <jsnow@redhat.com>,
	qemu-devel <qemu-devel@nongnu.org>,
	"Cleber Rosa" <crosa@redhat.com>,
	"Philippe Mathieu-Daudé" <philmd@linaro.org>,
	"Thomas Huth" <thuth@redhat.com>,
	"Beraldo Leal" <bleal@redhat.com>,
	"Michael Roth" <michael.roth@amd.com>,
	"Wainer dos Santos Moschetta" <wainersm@redhat.com>,
	"Paolo Bonzini" <pbonzini@redhat.com>,
	Qemu-block <qemu-block@nongnu.org>,
	"Hanna Reitz" <hreitz@redhat.com>,
	"Alex Bennée" <alex.bennee@linaro.org>,
	"Kevin Wolf" <kwolf@redhat.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v2 6/7] CI: Stop building docs on centos8
Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2023 08:40:20 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87cz6cpue3.fsf@pond.sub.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <Y+Z2Kcq17HGWuoTV@redhat.com> ("Daniel P. Berrangé"'s message of "Fri, 10 Feb 2023 16:51:53 +0000")

Daniel P. Berrangé <berrange@redhat.com> writes:

[...]

> We don't have to drop python 3.6. It is a choice because
> of a desire to be able to use some shiny new python
> features without caring about back compat.

I read this on Friday, and decided to let it sit until after the
weekend.  Well, it's now Tuesday, and to be frank, it's still as
offensively flippant as it was on Friday.  It shows either ignorance of
or cavalier disregard for the sheer amount of work some of us have had
to put into keeping old versions of Python viable.

The latter would be quite unlike you, so it must be the former.

John has sunk *man-months* into keeping old versions of Python viable.
I've put in a lot less myself, but still enough to be painfully aware of
it.  I figure Cleber and Beraldo are somewhere in between.

Insinuating John's proposal is motivated by "a desire to be able to use
some shiny new python features without caring about back compat"
disrespects all this work.

We should have a sober discussion on which versions of Python to work
with, and the tradeoffs involved.  But before I engage in that, I insist
on resetting the frame: no, this is not about shiny, new Python
features.  It is about stopping the bleeding.  It is about reducing what
feels more and more like bullshit work to me, so we can actually
accomplish stuff that matters.

And let's give the people who have been doing the actual work the
benefit of the doubt.

[...]



  parent reply	other threads:[~2023-02-14  7:41 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 71+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2023-02-10  0:31 [PATCH v2 0/7] Python: Drop support for Python 3.6 John Snow
2023-02-10  0:31 ` [PATCH v2 1/7] python: support pylint 2.16 John Snow
2023-02-10  0:31 ` [PATCH v2 2/7] python: drop pipenv John Snow
2023-02-10  0:31 ` [PATCH v2 3/7] configure: Look for auxiliary Python installations John Snow
2023-02-10  7:39   ` Thomas Huth
2023-02-10 10:45   ` Paolo Bonzini
2023-02-10 15:28     ` John Snow
2023-02-10 15:53       ` Peter Maydell
2023-02-10 16:17       ` Paolo Bonzini
2023-02-10 16:21         ` John Snow
2023-02-10 16:26           ` Paolo Bonzini
2023-02-10 19:56       ` Eric Blake
2023-02-10  0:31 ` [PATCH v2 4/7] configure: Add nice hint to Python failure message John Snow
2023-02-10  7:45   ` Thomas Huth
2023-02-10 19:19     ` John Snow
2023-02-10  0:31 ` [PATCH v2 5/7] DO-NOT-MERGE: testing: Add Python >= 3.7 to Centos, OpenSuSE John Snow
2023-02-10  0:31 ` [PATCH v2 6/7] CI: Stop building docs on centos8 John Snow
2023-02-10  7:06   ` Philippe Mathieu-Daudé
2023-02-10 10:41   ` Peter Maydell
2023-02-10 16:01     ` John Snow
2023-02-10 16:32       ` Peter Maydell
2023-02-10 16:51         ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-10 17:15           ` Peter Maydell
2023-02-10 18:27             ` Paolo Bonzini
2023-02-15 12:30               ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-14  7:40           ` Markus Armbruster [this message]
2023-02-14  8:35             ` Thomas Huth
2023-02-14  9:59               ` Alex Bennée
2023-02-14 12:10               ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-16  1:08                 ` Markus Armbruster
2023-02-16 11:00                   ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-14 10:33             ` Peter Maydell
2023-02-14 11:03             ` Kevin Wolf
2023-02-15 19:17               ` Markus Armbruster
2023-02-14 11:48             ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-14 14:03               ` Paolo Bonzini
2023-02-14 14:17                 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-14 17:26                 ` Kevin Wolf
2023-02-14 20:52                   ` Paolo Bonzini
2023-02-15 10:38                     ` Kevin Wolf
2023-02-15 11:35                     ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-16  1:46                       ` Markus Armbruster
2023-02-16 11:06                         ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-17 22:49                   ` John Snow
2023-02-20  8:51                     ` Markus Armbruster
2023-02-16 11:12                 ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-16 10:40               ` Markus Armbruster
2023-02-10 17:55         ` John Snow
2023-02-10 18:09           ` Peter Maydell
2023-02-10 20:31             ` Paolo Bonzini
2023-02-10  0:31 ` [PATCH v2 7/7] Python: Drop support for Python 3.6 John Snow
2023-02-10 10:04 ` [PATCH v2 0/7] " Markus Armbruster
2023-02-14 18:35 ` John Snow
2023-02-15 10:53   ` Kevin Wolf
2023-02-15 19:05 ` Markus Armbruster
2023-02-16 10:17   ` Peter Maydell
2023-02-16 12:31     ` Markus Armbruster
2023-02-16 10:58   ` Thomas Huth
2023-02-17  9:06     ` Markus Armbruster
2023-02-17  9:56       ` Thomas Huth
2023-02-17 15:37         ` Peter Maydell
2023-02-17 15:41           ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-17 10:01       ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-17 20:46     ` John Snow
2023-02-20  6:16       ` Thomas Huth
2023-02-20 19:56         ` John Snow
2023-02-21 12:00           ` Thomas Huth
2023-02-17 11:37 ` Proposed way forward " Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-17 13:46   ` Thomas Huth
2023-02-17 13:52     ` Daniel P. Berrangé
2023-02-17 14:40   ` Paolo Bonzini

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