From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E959BC636CC for ; Mon, 20 Feb 2023 09:23:33 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pU2NL-0007hs-1k; Mon, 20 Feb 2023 04:22:23 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pU2Ml-0006hX-C5 for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Mon, 20 Feb 2023 04:21:48 -0500 Received: from us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com ([170.10.133.124]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pU2Mi-0005U9-Na for qemu-devel@nongnu.org; Mon, 20 Feb 2023 04:21:46 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=redhat.com; s=mimecast20190719; t=1676884894; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=aM+9qdfYeaQgZV1mMl6MBJgeYU7a4b40TFO12f06g+w=; b=LP48O+agkfzYGjbh1EMCWJKVVnzQN0S6c7nVXZlMsgYz/e87An+ODEdKykw3EGqqsmKM+9 pmT7QoO7MQmQsbVdvWJUfbcJfpwzIT0i7KcVg31Ckf3TU0BiTtifygeNDU2/2WJ4SKaXwV /JN5R8OjiivtX2PCSMewGkiWZTVp8Ug= Received: from mimecast-mx02.redhat.com (mimecast-mx02.redhat.com [66.187.233.88]) by relay.mimecast.com with ESMTP with STARTTLS (version=TLSv1.2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id us-mta-556-cyIx9jlsOQ2FrC4E5VxbnA-1; Mon, 20 Feb 2023 04:21:30 -0500 X-MC-Unique: cyIx9jlsOQ2FrC4E5VxbnA-1 Received: from smtp.corp.redhat.com (int-mx07.intmail.prod.int.rdu2.redhat.com [10.11.54.7]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mimecast-mx02.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 65766185A794; Mon, 20 Feb 2023 09:21:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: from blackfin.pond.sub.org (unknown [10.39.192.25]) by smtp.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 444041415113; Mon, 20 Feb 2023 09:21:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: by blackfin.pond.sub.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 40DC821E6A1F; Mon, 20 Feb 2023 10:21:29 +0100 (CET) From: Markus Armbruster To: Thomas Huth Cc: Daniel P. =?utf-8?Q?Berrang=C3=A9?= , qemu-devel@nongnu.org, John Snow , Peter Maydell , Paolo Bonzini , Alex =?utf-8?Q?Benn=C3=A9e?= , Claudio Fontana Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH] docs/about/build-platforms: Refine the distro support policy References: <20230217132631.403112-1-thuth@redhat.com> Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2023 10:21:29 +0100 In-Reply-To: (Thomas Huth's message of "Fri, 17 Feb 2023 19:30:05 +0100") Message-ID: <87ilfwzo86.fsf@pond.sub.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.2 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 3.1 on 10.11.54.7 Received-SPF: pass client-ip=170.10.133.124; envelope-from=armbru@redhat.com; helo=us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: qemu-devel@nongnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: qemu-devel-bounces+qemu-devel=archiver.kernel.org@nongnu.org Sender: qemu-devel-bounces+qemu-devel=archiver.kernel.org@nongnu.org Thomas Huth writes: > On 17/02/2023 16.06, Daniel P. Berrang=C3=A9 wrote: >> On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 02:26:31PM +0100, Thomas Huth wrote: > ... >> I'm also not so comfortable dropping the only version of SLES that we >> explicitly target, when we don't know when their new major release >> will arrive. > > Let's hope that the next major version will show up at least five > years after the previous one ... but what if it takes many more years? > Do we want to support very old long term distros for "almost forever"? > > Also, should we maybe at least limit the time to 5 years? Otherwise, > if openSUSE 16 gets released 5 years after v15, we have to support v15 > for 7 years in total due to the "two more years" rule... Let's keep in mind that "2 years after the new major version" isn't the law, it's a rule we give ourselves so we don't have to debate from first principles every time. If supporting a major version of SLES (or anything for that matter) according to the rule becomes too expensive, we can and should change the rule. >> If we allow compilers, libraries to be bumped, then someone stuck on >> RHEL-8 has a significant task to build their own toolchain/libraries >> in order to work with QEMU still. If we only allow python modules to >> be bumped, the solution is just a pip install / virtualenv away. > > Honestly, being a Python ignorant, I'm more comfortable with > "./configure && make && make install" instead of messing up my system > with pip like I did in the past ... but I guess it's ok if it is > properly done automatically under the hood with a venv ... I'll get > used to it ;-) "pip in venv" should not mess up your system. Automation is of course welcome, and likely to reduce mess-ups through incorrect use / non-use of venvs. Optional dependencies default to off when not satisfied. Without automation, satisfying them is up to the developer. When you're not hacking on Python code yourself, there is no need for you to satisfy the mypy dependency, be it with dnf, pip, or whatever. I believe the one Python-related dependency of general interest right now is Sphinx, which is required for building documentation.