From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from lists.sourceforge.net (lists.sourceforge.net [216.105.38.7]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3F4E6C36005 for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2025 03:37:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=sfs-ml-3.v29.lw.sourceforge.com) by sfs-ml-3.v29.lw.sourceforge.com with esmtp (Exim 4.95) (envelope-from ) id 1txHaU-00037I-Bd; Wed, 26 Mar 2025 03:37:53 +0000 Received: from [172.30.29.66] (helo=mx.sourceforge.net) by sfs-ml-3.v29.lw.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.95) (envelope-from ) id 1txHaR-00037B-Oj for linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; Wed, 26 Mar 2025 03:37:51 +0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sourceforge.net; s=x; h=In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version:References: Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=L9gY5XDPpqmKquXY3BqLMX31PuZvhv7/DdoNmhC/YwM=; b=iFHX7PbFsuGsfCa+hmo5MIfkS0 C2jkeBDlQqaiVJjxHaRytNGKdAoeh+L1tKqO5dnBi8VqTuymcBdIF2B8uNI2yO05S9CyP+ZLAeaz9 +xTuidd+Ms1uBcVsVUAFWQOI5P4NUTEUT1eXqp5MEmaIfc3Bhgyzl54fTv0C9VCxtYEQ=; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sf.net; s=x ; h=In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version:References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To :From:Date:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=L9gY5XDPpqmKquXY3BqLMX31PuZvhv7/DdoNmhC/YwM=; b=b6G6vZr5Y/P4rZl4UVREtR5mdv H6uUyFRiRekQJz0BWCc5BgdS34+NyLOKzw26HhHhLbs4MVkifPzK2ZIfIpfPTqQXkPJAgzL/wGGzV dSg/KM1/8nQAslb/GLexrcaZU3sr3ODwVgq0vEGAtNw2NRd/cNfhCdfWsF3rmlrwj8Sk=; Received: from casper.infradead.org ([90.155.50.34]) by sfi-mx-2.v28.lw.sourceforge.com with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.95) id 1txHaQ-0001nO-3M for linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net; Wed, 26 Mar 2025 03:37:51 +0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=infradead.org; s=casper.20170209; h=In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version: References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Sender:Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description; bh=L9gY5XDPpqmKquXY3BqLMX31PuZvhv7/DdoNmhC/YwM=; b=EyyeqoOT/aKCoe22c/C8AZwzBV BMOOqQYPO4Q+WikKexayR7wVXQtMhmXZCtlVN4BLeAKXl6BP0ZZhiQdbH+A7kuIrDr8TTZxbf/Jec YhKzLQ1ouVvRhh1P3xFkqbqP1wSvAArqmnnTOnTpPHnbWm159TLGM4lIuWNQEnoth4XkAO1cNMe3W A6OQG2AXvcuxqS24m7YYKebVyYKhKlAdvos86MSguig2vvJbn3IcVnXBiYAvmkf0iZsX94NTdUerI Kp34/RRzR3K8a2LbTz+aDHK4EMPjQwwhqIuEV8pjWIsKHpbHxaF1W+rA9nIomCZTYbsLEXapdrXpS 9xWH6LPQ==; Received: from willy by casper.infradead.org with local (Exim 4.98.1 #2 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1txHaI-0000000H1Rc-3FJA; Wed, 26 Mar 2025 03:37:42 +0000 Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2025 03:37:42 +0000 From: Matthew Wilcox To: Jaegeuk Kim Message-ID: References: <20250307182151.3397003-1-willy@infradead.org> <174172263873.214029.5458881997469861795.git-patchwork-notify@kernel.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Headers-End: 1txHaQ-0001nO-3M Subject: Re: [f2fs-dev] [PATCH 0/4] f2fs: Remove uses of writepage X-BeenThere: linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: linux-f2fs-devel-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net On Fri, Mar 14, 2025 at 09:38:15PM +0000, Jaegeuk Kim wrote: > On 03/14, Matthew Wilcox wrote: > > Unfortunately, I thnk I have to abandon this effort. It's only going > > to make supporting large folios harder (ie there would then need to be > > an equivalently disruptive series adding support for large folios). > > > > The fundamental problem is that f2fs has no concept of block size != > > PAGE_SIZE. So if you create a filesystem on a 4kB PAGE_SIZE kernel, > > you can't mount it on a 16kB PAGE_SIZE kernel. An example: > > > > int f2fs_recover_inline_xattr(struct inode *inode, struct page *page) > > { > > struct f2fs_inode *ri; > > ipage = f2fs_get_node_page(F2FS_I_SB(inode), inode->i_ino); > > ri = F2FS_INODE(page); > > > > so an inode number is an index into the filesystem in PAGE_SIZE units, > > not in filesystem block size units. Fixing this is a major effort, and > > I lack the confidence in my abilities to do it without breaking anything. > > > > As an outline of what needs to happen, I think that rather than passing > > around so many struct page pointers, we should be passing around either > > folio + offset, or we should be passing around struct f2fs_inode pointers. > > My preference is for the latter. We can always convert back to the > > folio containing the inode if we need to (eg to mark it dirty) and it > > adds some typesafety by ensuring that we're passing around pointers that > > we believe belong to an inode and not, say, a struct page which happens > > to contain a directory entry. > > > > This is a monster task, I think. I'm going to have to disable f2fs > > from testing with split page/folio. This is going to be a big problem > > for Android. > > I see. fyi; in Android, I'm thinking to run 16KB page kernel with 16KB format > natively to keep block_size = PAGE_SIZE. Wasn't large folio to support a set > of pages while keeping block_size = PAGE_SIZE? Oh, I think I do see a possible argument for continuing this work. If we have an f2fs filesystem with a 16kB block size, we can use order-0 folios with a 16kB PAGE_SIZE kernel, and if we want to mount it on a kernel with a 4kB PAGE_SIZE kernel, then we can use order-2 folios to do that. Is that a useful improvement to f2fs? It's not really the intent of large folios; it's supposed to be used to support arbitrary order folios. But we have all the pieces in place such that we could tell the page cache min-order = max-order = 2. _______________________________________________ Linux-f2fs-devel mailing list Linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/linux-f2fs-devel From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from casper.infradead.org (casper.infradead.org [90.155.50.34]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5CC8A63CB for ; Wed, 26 Mar 2025 03:37:44 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=90.155.50.34 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1742960265; cv=none; b=gQpXqEZRD+poS04W4vMUsQRzXios+N4nRckXWmdI8g+u81jC0eMYIYUOZQ/h57wGGFgv/XmsplNJNZciAE3XvpFjvZPiWMwvgMwjWC6/Z4/Uo7Z/Ow0FFAfXedYNH6aaJukXI6CK/TnmTHJAu8i4wOuFTtX/9Y1/lSguM7M3Tm0= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1742960265; c=relaxed/simple; bh=d6jdR0tl0fMe/7cXAgiHVB8OL2b58GVY5cSlgz2f5Zo=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:References:MIME-Version: Content-Type:Content-Disposition:In-Reply-To; b=bJvhRU1n1yTdT2mmEitqNtCkcMZequhD0xQuEwSnQ4+x7va/AjHljs/PsT/iY9dvd0CzMOv29cW1LaxdjC6OqbB6nDl2iPvTRqLB2E9TJjIWVQUGo8UM84uSCUva2Nw4zidiplC9CjQd7g5BJqAb0ITiawRv+QwkdHP1IoDFo8w= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=infradead.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=infradead.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=infradead.org header.i=@infradead.org header.b=EyyeqoOT; arc=none smtp.client-ip=90.155.50.34 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=infradead.org Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; spf=none smtp.mailfrom=infradead.org Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=infradead.org header.i=@infradead.org header.b="EyyeqoOT" DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=infradead.org; s=casper.20170209; h=In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version: References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Sender:Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description; bh=L9gY5XDPpqmKquXY3BqLMX31PuZvhv7/DdoNmhC/YwM=; b=EyyeqoOT/aKCoe22c/C8AZwzBV BMOOqQYPO4Q+WikKexayR7wVXQtMhmXZCtlVN4BLeAKXl6BP0ZZhiQdbH+A7kuIrDr8TTZxbf/Jec YhKzLQ1ouVvRhh1P3xFkqbqP1wSvAArqmnnTOnTpPHnbWm159TLGM4lIuWNQEnoth4XkAO1cNMe3W A6OQG2AXvcuxqS24m7YYKebVyYKhKlAdvos86MSguig2vvJbn3IcVnXBiYAvmkf0iZsX94NTdUerI Kp34/RRzR3K8a2LbTz+aDHK4EMPjQwwhqIuEV8pjWIsKHpbHxaF1W+rA9nIomCZTYbsLEXapdrXpS 9xWH6LPQ==; Received: from willy by casper.infradead.org with local (Exim 4.98.1 #2 (Red Hat Linux)) id 1txHaI-0000000H1Rc-3FJA; Wed, 26 Mar 2025 03:37:42 +0000 Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2025 03:37:42 +0000 From: Matthew Wilcox To: Jaegeuk Kim Cc: chao@kernel.org, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-f2fs-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [f2fs-dev] [PATCH 0/4] f2fs: Remove uses of writepage Message-ID: References: <20250307182151.3397003-1-willy@infradead.org> <174172263873.214029.5458881997469861795.git-patchwork-notify@kernel.org> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: On Fri, Mar 14, 2025 at 09:38:15PM +0000, Jaegeuk Kim wrote: > On 03/14, Matthew Wilcox wrote: > > Unfortunately, I thnk I have to abandon this effort. It's only going > > to make supporting large folios harder (ie there would then need to be > > an equivalently disruptive series adding support for large folios). > > > > The fundamental problem is that f2fs has no concept of block size != > > PAGE_SIZE. So if you create a filesystem on a 4kB PAGE_SIZE kernel, > > you can't mount it on a 16kB PAGE_SIZE kernel. An example: > > > > int f2fs_recover_inline_xattr(struct inode *inode, struct page *page) > > { > > struct f2fs_inode *ri; > > ipage = f2fs_get_node_page(F2FS_I_SB(inode), inode->i_ino); > > ri = F2FS_INODE(page); > > > > so an inode number is an index into the filesystem in PAGE_SIZE units, > > not in filesystem block size units. Fixing this is a major effort, and > > I lack the confidence in my abilities to do it without breaking anything. > > > > As an outline of what needs to happen, I think that rather than passing > > around so many struct page pointers, we should be passing around either > > folio + offset, or we should be passing around struct f2fs_inode pointers. > > My preference is for the latter. We can always convert back to the > > folio containing the inode if we need to (eg to mark it dirty) and it > > adds some typesafety by ensuring that we're passing around pointers that > > we believe belong to an inode and not, say, a struct page which happens > > to contain a directory entry. > > > > This is a monster task, I think. I'm going to have to disable f2fs > > from testing with split page/folio. This is going to be a big problem > > for Android. > > I see. fyi; in Android, I'm thinking to run 16KB page kernel with 16KB format > natively to keep block_size = PAGE_SIZE. Wasn't large folio to support a set > of pages while keeping block_size = PAGE_SIZE? Oh, I think I do see a possible argument for continuing this work. If we have an f2fs filesystem with a 16kB block size, we can use order-0 folios with a 16kB PAGE_SIZE kernel, and if we want to mount it on a kernel with a 4kB PAGE_SIZE kernel, then we can use order-2 folios to do that. Is that a useful improvement to f2fs? It's not really the intent of large folios; it's supposed to be used to support arbitrary order folios. But we have all the pieces in place such that we could tell the page cache min-order = max-order = 2.