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charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: intel-wired-lan-bounces@osuosl.org Sender: "Intel-wired-lan" On Thu, Mar 30, 2023 at 10:25:05AM -0700, Jakub Kicinski wrote: > On Thu, 30 Mar 2023 09:03:09 -0300 Jason Gunthorpe wrote: > > On Wed, Mar 29, 2023 at 07:03:49AM -0700, Pavan Kumar Linga wrote: > > > This patch series introduces the Infrastructure Data Path Function (IDPF) > > > driver. It is used for both physical and virtual functions. Except for > > > some of the device operations the rest of the functionality is the same > > > for both PF and VF. IDPF uses virtchnl version2 opcodes and structures > > > defined in the virtchnl2 header file which helps the driver to learn > > > the capabilities and register offsets from the device Control Plane (CP) > > > instead of assuming the default values. > > > > Isn't IDPF currently being "standardized" at OASIS? > > > > Has a standard been ratified? Isn't it rather premature to merge a > > driver for a standard that doesn't exist? > > > > Publicly posting pre-ratification work is often against the IP > > policies of standards orgs, are you even legally OK to post this? > > > > Confused, > > And you called me politically motivated in the discussion about RDMA :| > Vendor posts a driver, nothing special as far as netdev is concerned. The patches directly link to the OASIS working group, they need to explain WTF is going on here. The published doucments they link to expressly say: This is version 0.9 of IDPF Specification, to serve as basis for IDPF TC work. This is a work-in-progress document, and should not be used for implementation as is. Further OASIS has a legal IPR policy that basically means Intel needs to publicly justify that their Signed-off-by is consisent with the kernel rules of the DCO. ie that they have a legal right to submit this IP to the kernel. It is frequent that people make IPR mistakes, it is something maintainers should be double-checking when they are aware of it. Frankly, this stopped being a "vendor driver" as soon as they linked to OASIS documents. More broadly we have seen good success in Linux with the standards-first model. NVMe for example will not merge "vendor extensions" and the like that are not in the published ratified standard. It gives more power to the standards bodies and encourages vendor collaboration. It is up to netdev community, but it looks pretty wild to see patches link to a supposed multi-vendor OASIS standard, put the implementation under net/ethernet/intel/idpf/ and come before standard ratification. It is a legitimate question if that is how netdev community wants to manage its standard backed drivers. Jason _______________________________________________ Intel-wired-lan mailing list Intel-wired-lan@osuosl.org https://lists.osuosl.org/mailman/listinfo/intel-wired-lan From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9003C6FD1D for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2023 18:29:46 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S230423AbjC3S3p (ORCPT ); Thu, 30 Mar 2023 14:29:45 -0400 Received: from lindbergh.monkeyblade.net ([23.128.96.19]:59102 "EHLO lindbergh.monkeyblade.net" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S230019AbjC3S3o (ORCPT ); Thu, 30 Mar 2023 14:29:44 -0400 Received: from NAM02-DM3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-dm3nam02on2049.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.107.95.49]) by lindbergh.monkeyblade.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 374932133 for ; 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Thu, 30 Mar 2023 18:29:41 +0000 Received: from LV2PR12MB5869.namprd12.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::ef6d:fdf6:352f:efd1]) by LV2PR12MB5869.namprd12.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::ef6d:fdf6:352f:efd1%3]) with mapi id 15.20.6178.037; Thu, 30 Mar 2023 18:29:40 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2023 15:29:39 -0300 From: Jason Gunthorpe To: Jakub Kicinski Cc: Pavan Kumar Linga , intel-wired-lan@lists.osuosl.org, netdev@vger.kernel.org, shiraz.saleem@intel.com, emil.s.tantilov@intel.com, willemb@google.com, decot@google.com, joshua.a.hay@intel.com, sridhar.samudrala@intel.com, Christoph Hellwig Subject: Re: [Intel-wired-lan] [PATCH net-next 00/15] Introduce IDPF driver Message-ID: References: <20230329140404.1647925-1-pavan.kumar.linga@intel.com> <20230330102505.6d3b88da@kernel.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20230330102505.6d3b88da@kernel.org> X-ClientProxiedBy: BL1PR13CA0342.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:208:2c6::17) To LV2PR12MB5869.namprd12.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:408:176::16) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email X-MS-TrafficTypeDiagnostic: LV2PR12MB5869:EE_|BY5PR12MB4084:EE_ X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: bbb5063f-dba0-4bcf-3615-08db314cb9cb X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck: 1 X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-Relay: 0 X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0; 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X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount: 1 X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0: =?us-ascii?Q?T19uVoTU6G+hTdEOzaDDWa16/6uziUfDNFSLo6zd4mKQ3H3gyYpaKSp5BgU/?= =?us-ascii?Q?lpVlzeeHC+saFSbWCxCBjan3np3pewF/h/okXm4Kqu/eLvBApwEfMN4x/8YG?= =?us-ascii?Q?+F9R5ODRT7vO4LV7idomT7U93N9as+201wbNdN1c9leBVN3eqrAxv0ocNs8s?= =?us-ascii?Q?e75UWetk6ljXgRwj/UX9IZRzTTlbF68CPeUGZuZu2C43HdWXtC9o96FrV7LA?= =?us-ascii?Q?y723vb1s+4th2pihkCYEnn5rCxhspI6ez2u/4wG9DrjRCu/K7lZSoY4wj9Ut?= =?us-ascii?Q?ueB8e8dPhm+6r0KMViaALCsRsYPF3V2VBNCUNt63zByKXSbn+mDss4HVVevM?= =?us-ascii?Q?wR3RiuLBQK19E58jU6go4e+ANAqeteV2tjPW7XvqjvrV5Sct+9wn+6/DAfW+?= =?us-ascii?Q?v2NQv2zog8h0FCmkQdpeAi4GBC23BbCduTM5XA16hi6PrI7Fet+c8w8HMiz9?= =?us-ascii?Q?R97uTWvVHKiZf3fO+wl+uowaIhkwMg2p8Ex92SBfIFU+gy6iaRbutEqRP9Fl?= =?us-ascii?Q?kTR0e/ugj/VXkoVz10qoIJfSgrI6XTb956sjvj4TR52kwf6wqnFV2toBql9o?= =?us-ascii?Q?crCSFtoPDAYT18/Zzx5+aD3e7QGL8IWCxrxpnx9MMNrhsMYQTquS6x2ZyFyc?= =?us-ascii?Q?iKYnmCHmJclcpIIn0QXb5+5JMoZNqlsCYv09Gd0bjIhx9wGZisFeQFKctmK2?= =?us-ascii?Q?VEvMCTZgugJ0HwyJ0kc/wb1s6duUraygL9eQLufKWBCG8jfQx3xrvt8ZiNWS?= =?us-ascii?Q?D4YVrfn1hMXLGpelFZHLfnQt2iKIRf5vMezuCBNsXVupqO6pEnukcgBwELYt?= =?us-ascii?Q?MMKcfFb0XCnIU3+0qoTqscii/zUZPoLz7/rM71b0ElG8PRqb1ErtrAiUuMiY?= =?us-ascii?Q?+SIIcuYRiCQ6ZOshJfoCiPif+WDOAitqQIdpS0hIeHARyCvj6XzIyS2QxgSt?= =?us-ascii?Q?KFYWSuTJOu5lZXrGonK7VVbAX8QTei+1TBAdi+a2EQjR2eByyRDad5Zkcty3?= =?us-ascii?Q?zlS9SPRjXmwlqkyImaaClU6X3ar7kKm++Kbd3OUWQRTrOH2QOV2Ar3oUNQBX?= =?us-ascii?Q?Ivwrne0oD2gjOy8cQWUWcRjY0nQ9IrXrR9KKIJH5RYiG4eAlWzBMmH1QLCzC?= =?us-ascii?Q?YcpObPcWdgo9O42zydXx1ntOud0ksqOnV5DS7AsIbZMB48QAbJTwh54O88se?= =?us-ascii?Q?jpcWNwatgQ3i+u2dVcBFIR+KY7uRaIVurQmsAAK1k2GC5QCm9z1h1WXwMEES?= =?us-ascii?Q?VhQpUfan0Mgvd5HBatWKF9EkpX5c2pmU1QbIAyYPjK1OyLe3z0NilRO2jHkV?= =?us-ascii?Q?oJ4onDYEP8dl4yfJ96z4CgunTBPG2hBcc5q9j6zSsvlmvfbZr4YvkQfvw9L6?= =?us-ascii?Q?jP/9midSC9N9OUHPK7mskxt5dS6gupHTWJJp1ajGLbZaP+hGNQBd3FLDFllD?= =?us-ascii?Q?jJ4GAM0rQ9IOBiS6TuZMpe07D01DPhIDjeGVTB2LNUniaNAUHmuI3STCumef?= =?us-ascii?Q?1rnL9UNrih0fj2mlN8d8rPtq77TZ6CuLz3+pFHg+qRb1NFiStdwXVGK5DcTY?= =?us-ascii?Q?1u7fL7ZhD/QBnVhuKi0veOfF8Lk9p8/c27+e8Ldt?= X-OriginatorOrg: Nvidia.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: bbb5063f-dba0-4bcf-3615-08db314cb9cb X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: LV2PR12MB5869.namprd12.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Mar 2023 18:29:40.8685 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Id: 43083d15-7273-40c1-b7db-39efd9ccc17a X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-MailboxType: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-UserPrincipalName: AOAnHLvkMx8bxkg5TDzKFzkritZrYMLpnaurv4FalwghCQKMPFgBt3U3GWRu9gNl X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BY5PR12MB4084 Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: netdev@vger.kernel.org On Thu, Mar 30, 2023 at 10:25:05AM -0700, Jakub Kicinski wrote: > On Thu, 30 Mar 2023 09:03:09 -0300 Jason Gunthorpe wrote: > > On Wed, Mar 29, 2023 at 07:03:49AM -0700, Pavan Kumar Linga wrote: > > > This patch series introduces the Infrastructure Data Path Function (IDPF) > > > driver. It is used for both physical and virtual functions. Except for > > > some of the device operations the rest of the functionality is the same > > > for both PF and VF. IDPF uses virtchnl version2 opcodes and structures > > > defined in the virtchnl2 header file which helps the driver to learn > > > the capabilities and register offsets from the device Control Plane (CP) > > > instead of assuming the default values. > > > > Isn't IDPF currently being "standardized" at OASIS? > > > > Has a standard been ratified? Isn't it rather premature to merge a > > driver for a standard that doesn't exist? > > > > Publicly posting pre-ratification work is often against the IP > > policies of standards orgs, are you even legally OK to post this? > > > > Confused, > > And you called me politically motivated in the discussion about RDMA :| > Vendor posts a driver, nothing special as far as netdev is concerned. The patches directly link to the OASIS working group, they need to explain WTF is going on here. The published doucments they link to expressly say: This is version 0.9 of IDPF Specification, to serve as basis for IDPF TC work. This is a work-in-progress document, and should not be used for implementation as is. Further OASIS has a legal IPR policy that basically means Intel needs to publicly justify that their Signed-off-by is consisent with the kernel rules of the DCO. ie that they have a legal right to submit this IP to the kernel. It is frequent that people make IPR mistakes, it is something maintainers should be double-checking when they are aware of it. Frankly, this stopped being a "vendor driver" as soon as they linked to OASIS documents. More broadly we have seen good success in Linux with the standards-first model. NVMe for example will not merge "vendor extensions" and the like that are not in the published ratified standard. It gives more power to the standards bodies and encourages vendor collaboration. It is up to netdev community, but it looks pretty wild to see patches link to a supposed multi-vendor OASIS standard, put the implementation under net/ethernet/intel/idpf/ and come before standard ratification. It is a legitimate question if that is how netdev community wants to manage its standard backed drivers. Jason