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From: Sean Christopherson <seanjc@google.com>
To: David Matlack <dmatlack@google.com>
Cc: Peter Xu <peterx@redhat.com>, Paolo Bonzini <pbonzini@redhat.com>,
	 kvm list <kvm@vger.kernel.org>,
	James Houghton <jthoughton@google.com>,
	 Oliver Upton <oupton@google.com>,
	Axel Rasmussen <axelrasmussen@google.com>,
	 Mike Kravetz <mike.kravetz@oracle.com>,
	Andrea Arcangeli <aarcange@redhat.com>
Subject: Re: RFC: A KVM-specific alternative to UserfaultFD
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2023 15:54:51 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <ZU1xS4g1eytrrhbI@google.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CALzav=d0KK6ia0=BwUeogeXPXuiyru--i7-t-RTusCyPfy5ruA@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Nov 09, 2023, David Matlack wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 9, 2023 at 10:33 AM David Matlack <dmatlack@google.com> wrote:
> > On Thu, Nov 9, 2023 at 9:58 AM Sean Christopherson <seanjc@google.com> wrote:
> > > For both cases, KVM will need choke points on all accesses to guest memory.  Once
> > > the choke points exist and we have signed up to maintain them, the extra burden of
> > > gracefully handling "missing" memory versus frozen memory should be relatively
> > > small, e.g. it'll mainly be the notify-and-wait uAPI.
> >
> > To be honest, the choke points are a relatively small part of any
> > KVM-based demand paging scheme. We still need (a)-(e) from my original
> > email.
> 
> Another small thing here: I think we can find clean choke point(s)
> that fit both freezing and demand paging (aka "missing" pages), but
> there is a difference to keep in mind. To freeze guest memory KVM only
> needs to return an error at the choke point(s). Whereas handling
> "missing" pages may require blocking, which adds constraints on where
> the choke point(s) can be placed.

Rats, I didn't think about not being able to block.  Luckily, that's *almost* a
non-issue as user accesses already might_sleep().  At a glance, it's only x86's
shadow paging that uses kvm_vcpu_read_guest_atomic(), everything else either can
sleep or uses a gfn_to_pfn_cache or kvm_host_map cache.  Aha!  And all of x86's
usage can fail gracefully (for some definitions of gracefully), i.e. will either
result in the access being retried after dropping mmu_lock or will cause KVM to
zap a SPTE instead of doing something more optimal.

  reply	other threads:[~2023-11-09 23:54 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 34+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2023-11-06 18:25 RFC: A KVM-specific alternative to UserfaultFD David Matlack
2023-11-06 20:23 ` Peter Xu
2023-11-06 22:24   ` Axel Rasmussen
2023-11-06 23:03     ` Peter Xu
2023-11-06 23:22       ` David Matlack
2023-11-07 14:21         ` Peter Xu
2023-11-07 16:11           ` James Houghton
2023-11-07 17:24             ` Peter Xu
2023-11-07 19:08               ` James Houghton
2023-11-07 16:25   ` Paolo Bonzini
2023-11-07 20:04     ` David Matlack
2023-11-07 21:10       ` Oliver Upton
2023-11-07 21:34         ` David Matlack
2023-11-08  1:27           ` Oliver Upton
2023-11-08 16:56             ` David Matlack
2023-11-08 17:34               ` Peter Xu
2023-11-08 20:10                 ` Sean Christopherson
2023-11-08 20:36                   ` Peter Xu
2023-11-08 20:47                   ` Axel Rasmussen
2023-11-08 21:05                     ` David Matlack
2023-11-08 20:49                 ` David Matlack
2023-11-08 20:33               ` Paolo Bonzini
2023-11-08 20:43                 ` David Matlack
2023-11-07 22:29     ` Peter Xu
2023-11-09 16:41       ` David Matlack
2023-11-09 17:58         ` Sean Christopherson
2023-11-09 18:33           ` David Matlack
2023-11-09 22:44             ` David Matlack
2023-11-09 23:54               ` Sean Christopherson [this message]
2023-11-09 19:20           ` Peter Xu
2023-11-11 16:23             ` David Matlack
2023-11-11 17:30               ` Peter Xu
2023-11-13 16:43                 ` David Matlack
2023-11-20 18:32                   ` James Houghton

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