[B.A.T.M.A.N.] Is BATMAN alone enough to create wireless mesh networks?

[B.A.T.M.A.N.] Is BATMAN alone enough to create wireless mesh networks?

[crocket]

I've been searching for wireless mesh network solutions.
BATMAN showed up in google search results.

I just wonder its role and the future of it, and I want to know if it
can power wireless mesh networks in android phones.

Re: [B.A.T.M.A.N.] Is BATMAN alone enough to create wireless mesh networks?

[Elektra]

Hi  –

B.A.T.M.A.N. refers to a routing algorithm. 

There are implementations of the routing algorithom at OSI layer 2 (batman-advanced) and layer 3 (batmand, bmx6)

You can use all 3 variants for Android to build wireless mesh networks and people are actually doing so (Serval)

Integrating batman-advanced into Android requires you to not only have root, but also provide a batman-adv kernel module that fits the kernel of the device. This is fine, if someone like Google or Cyanogenmod would enclude batman-adv in their Android builds, which would merely require to enable building the module in the kernel build process, as it is shipped with the vanilla kernel sources.

batmand and bmx6 are user space programs that merely alter the routing table. Integrating these is easier, since you merely require root permissions to run them.

Cheers,
Elektra


> I've been searching for wireless mesh network solutions.
> BATMAN showed up in google search results.
> 
> I just wonder its role and the future of it, and I want to know if it
> can power wireless mesh networks in android phones.


-- 
Elektra <onelektra@gmx.net>

Re: [B.A.T.M.A.N.] Is BATMAN alone enough to create wireless mesh networks?

[cmsv]

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I am also interested in the android and batman-adv mesh network. The
topic has been mentioned in the mailing list before.

https://lists.open-mesh.org/pipermail/b.a.t.m.a.n/2013-February/009099.html

Android phones are connecting without carrier networks
http://www.networkworld.com/community/blog/android-phones-are-connecting-without-carrier-networks

https://lists.open-mesh.org/pipermail/b.a.t.m.a.n/2013-May/009587.html

Most Android phones run constrained versions of the operating system,
due to limitations implemented by the manufacturers and operators. In
order to be able to benefit from the full potential of the Android OS,
and more specifically to switch on the ad-hoc mode on the wireless
interface of the devices, we need first to gain full control of the
Linux subsystem. This implies modifying the access rights on the phones,
by performing what is called a rooting procedure.

While root access does not seem to be a problem; capacity processing for
data/traffic through it may be. All depends on the hardware.

I have also thought about the openmoko which is an opensource phone.


On 01/24/2014 10:47 AM, Elektra wrote:
> Hi  –
> 
> B.A.T.M.A.N. refers to a routing algorithm. 
> 
> There are implementations of the routing algorithom at OSI layer 2 (batman-advanced) and layer 3 (batmand, bmx6)
> 
> You can use all 3 variants for Android to build wireless mesh networks and people are actually doing so (Serval)
> 
> Integrating batman-advanced into Android requires you to not only have root, but also provide a batman-adv kernel module that fits the kernel of the device. This is fine, if someone like Google or Cyanogenmod would enclude batman-adv in their Android builds, which would merely require to enable building the module in the kernel build process, as it is shipped with the vanilla kernel sources.
> 
> batmand and bmx6 are user space programs that merely alter the routing table. Integrating these is easier, since you merely require root permissions to run them.
> 
> Cheers,
> Elektra
> 
> 
>> I've been searching for wireless mesh network solutions.
>> BATMAN showed up in google search results.
>>
>> I just wonder its role and the future of it, and I want to know if it
>> can power wireless mesh networks in android phones.
> 
> 


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Re: [B.A.T.M.A.N.] Is BATMAN alone enough to create wireless mesh networks?

[crocket]

So is BATMAN a full-fledged alternative to 802.11s?

On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:47 AM, Elektra <onelektra@gmx.net> wrote:
> Hi  –
>
> B.A.T.M.A.N. refers to a routing algorithm.
>
> There are implementations of the routing algorithom at OSI layer 2 (batman-advanced) and layer 3 (batmand, bmx6)
>
> You can use all 3 variants for Android to build wireless mesh networks and people are actually doing so (Serval)
>
> Integrating batman-advanced into Android requires you to not only have root, but also provide a batman-adv kernel module that fits the kernel of the device. This is fine, if someone like Google or Cyanogenmod would enclude batman-adv in their Android builds, which would merely require to enable building the module in the kernel build process, as it is shipped with the vanilla kernel sources.
>
> batmand and bmx6 are user space programs that merely alter the routing table. Integrating these is easier, since you merely require root permissions to run them.
>
> Cheers,
> Elektra
>
>
>> I've been searching for wireless mesh network solutions.
>> BATMAN showed up in google search results.
>>
>> I just wonder its role and the future of it, and I want to know if it
>> can power wireless mesh networks in android phones.
>
>
> --
> Elektra <onelektra@gmx.net>

Re: [B.A.T.M.A.N.] Is BATMAN alone enough to create wireless mesh networks?

[Antonio Quartulli]

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On 25/01/14 01:29, crocket wrote:
> So is BATMAN a full-fledged alternative to 802.11s?

No.

802.11s is implemented at the datalink layer (actually inside the
mac80211 kernel module) and provides you a way to establish a connection
with other peers.

With batman-adv you first need to establish the connection with the
other nodes by means of adhoc or infrastructure mode (or any other kind
of connection that creates a virtual Ethernet interface).

Therefore when using batman-adv (or batmand or bmx6) you first need to
establish a datalink layer connection and then you can use the protocol
on top of it.

In the case of 802.11s the datalink connection is handled by itself
directly.

I would say that it is a small difference, but then the sentence would be:

"{batman-adv + adhoc mode} is an alternative to 802.11s"

batman-adv took this approach because we believe that there is no need
to re-implement something that we already have (e.g. adhoc mode) and at
the same time this gives batman-adv more flexibility (it can be used
also on top of wired Ethernet interfaces).


Cheers,

> 
> On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:47 AM, Elektra <onelektra@gmx.net> wrote:
>> Hi  –
>>
>> B.A.T.M.A.N. refers to a routing algorithm.
>>
>> There are implementations of the routing algorithom at OSI layer 2 (batman-advanced) and layer 3 (batmand, bmx6)
>>
>> You can use all 3 variants for Android to build wireless mesh networks and people are actually doing so (Serval)
>>
>> Integrating batman-advanced into Android requires you to not only have root, but also provide a batman-adv kernel module that fits the kernel of the device. This is fine, if someone like Google or Cyanogenmod would enclude batman-adv in their Android builds, which would merely require to enable building the module in the kernel build process, as it is shipped with the vanilla kernel sources.
>>
>> batmand and bmx6 are user space programs that merely alter the routing table. Integrating these is easier, since you merely require root permissions to run them.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Elektra
>>
>>
>>> I've been searching for wireless mesh network solutions.
>>> BATMAN showed up in google search results.
>>>
>>> I just wonder its role and the future of it, and I want to know if it
>>> can power wireless mesh networks in android phones.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Elektra <onelektra@gmx.net>
> 


-- 
Antonio Quartulli


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Re: [B.A.T.M.A.N.] Is BATMAN alone enough to create wireless mesh networks?

[crocket]

According to your explanation, batman-adv can't enable my smartphone
to automatically discover nearby smartphones and connect with them.
802.11s, on the other hand, can do it if it's combined with automatic
IP address allocation scheme.

Did I miss something?

On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 6:18 PM, Antonio Quartulli
<antonio@meshcoding.com> wrote:
> On 25/01/14 01:29, crocket wrote:
>> So is BATMAN a full-fledged alternative to 802.11s?
>
> No.
>
> 802.11s is implemented at the datalink layer (actually inside the
> mac80211 kernel module) and provides you a way to establish a connection
> with other peers.
>
> With batman-adv you first need to establish the connection with the
> other nodes by means of adhoc or infrastructure mode (or any other kind
> of connection that creates a virtual Ethernet interface).
>
> Therefore when using batman-adv (or batmand or bmx6) you first need to
> establish a datalink layer connection and then you can use the protocol
> on top of it.
>
> In the case of 802.11s the datalink connection is handled by itself
> directly.
>
> I would say that it is a small difference, but then the sentence would be:
>
> "{batman-adv + adhoc mode} is an alternative to 802.11s"
>
> batman-adv took this approach because we believe that there is no need
> to re-implement something that we already have (e.g. adhoc mode) and at
> the same time this gives batman-adv more flexibility (it can be used
> also on top of wired Ethernet interfaces).
>
>
> Cheers,
>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:47 AM, Elektra <onelektra@gmx.net> wrote:
>>> Hi  –
>>>
>>> B.A.T.M.A.N. refers to a routing algorithm.
>>>
>>> There are implementations of the routing algorithom at OSI layer 2 (batman-advanced) and layer 3 (batmand, bmx6)
>>>
>>> You can use all 3 variants for Android to build wireless mesh networks and people are actually doing so (Serval)
>>>
>>> Integrating batman-advanced into Android requires you to not only have root, but also provide a batman-adv kernel module that fits the kernel of the device. This is fine, if someone like Google or Cyanogenmod would enclude batman-adv in their Android builds, which would merely require to enable building the module in the kernel build process, as it is shipped with the vanilla kernel sources.
>>>
>>> batmand and bmx6 are user space programs that merely alter the routing table. Integrating these is easier, since you merely require root permissions to run them.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Elektra
>>>
>>>
>>>> I've been searching for wireless mesh network solutions.
>>>> BATMAN showed up in google search results.
>>>>
>>>> I just wonder its role and the future of it, and I want to know if it
>>>> can power wireless mesh networks in android phones.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Elektra <onelektra@gmx.net>
>>
>
>
> --
> Antonio Quartulli
>

Re: [B.A.T.M.A.N.] Is BATMAN alone enough to create wireless mesh networks?

[Marek Lindner]

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On Monday 27 January 2014 12:58:30 crocket wrote:
> According to your explanation, batman-adv can't enable my smartphone
> to automatically discover nearby smartphones and connect with them.
> 802.11s, on the other hand, can do it if it's combined with automatic
> IP address allocation scheme.
> 
> Did I miss something?

Yes, batman-adv is able to do what you describe above. However, this all 
sounds extremely theoretical from your end. How about you get yourself a 
rooted smartphone or notebook to play around with these different technologies 
and then come back with specific questions ?

Cheers,
Marek

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