From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from diktynna.open-mesh.org (diktynna.open-mesh.org [136.243.236.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0A911CA0FF2 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 2025 01:50:48 +0000 (UTC) Received: from diktynna.open-mesh.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by diktynna.open-mesh.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4510C83E16 for ; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 03:50:47 +0200 (CEST) ARC-Seal: i=2; cv=pass; a=rsa-sha256; d=open-mesh.org; s=20121; t=1756691447; b=alttFKiRecl2ulVx2ztzLmhEdzOZ5Grh5d0kg1ifPavW1fWIDAtrL5rz07DgaYPTclAkt YBMvqd+1qGAf2n9+jmo3ERUcWKm7ZbYHtKTyerOJ3GZ0LVIHIflw1nATc/vD2R+ZZ8njSRa 5tuOb3k3fl/oHFDV2eufU863ZgKUras= ARC-Message-Signature: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=open-mesh.org; s=20121; t=1756691447; h=from : sender : reply-to : subject : date : message-id : to : cc : mime-version : content-type : content-transfer-encoding : content-id : content-description : resent-date : resent-from : resent-sender : resent-to : resent-cc : resent-message-id : in-reply-to : references : list-id : list-help : list-unsubscribe : list-subscribe : list-post : list-owner : list-archive; bh=N4bnpA/HOdFOXnMD6fv9VGVJB7aMOJ5cCx4HPUQZRIE=; b=hmflszV44+sv35ag6AZ/oAEDnUNvorWRQju6W18uV+wIuKBoPMUTuqpYBm0mJ4/ZBPqYV xYbXSclRV+TzEZvMSoV+Mtvi1duTM1H52OkZLxp5F5CuB+Xqk78578zKHlq3tP/7shp9pmE zYRhW/o0tG48EzxIWeyJy2NDoAjPd+c= ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; open-mesh.org; dkim=fail; arc=pass; dmarc=none Authentication-Results: open-mesh.org; dkim=fail; arc=pass; dmarc=none Received: from mail.aperture-lab.de (mail.aperture-lab.de [IPv6:2a01:4f8:c2c:665b::1]) by diktynna.open-mesh.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C13F8837F8 for ; Mon, 01 Sep 2025 03:50:16 +0200 (CEST) ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=open-mesh.org; s=20121; t=1756691426; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=N4bnpA/HOdFOXnMD6fv9VGVJB7aMOJ5cCx4HPUQZRIE=; b=Gnfbwq1FYQG1UN5YpenuEZIGk17t1Il0Iyh3SiAlL+zDLEkYPuIhuiukdSz6vGWX0Sl2Tv rGpgOPxvYVGUVpEPOp4F9K+jv3v9jWgwmXI3wUS0nnIgl4pJTeYrdQq5sYmEbb/srCjsbQ I5inYFQ3kEAvEGI+UThJLWm8NafAChA= ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; diktynna.open-mesh.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (diktynna.open-mesh.org: domain of linus.luessing@c0d3.blue designates 2a01:4f8:c2c:665b::1 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=linus.luessing@c0d3.blue ARC-Seal: i=1; s=20121; d=open-mesh.org; t=1756691426; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=0yunyt76BAZiQ2wW5649I3MsDEk5Jpl5MzU/NoEsgwUnkFHep07/YPDUy94njom4emA8eK GI8ONyMBctOScvzYbNJJ87p07omemTR+y7Mi3/PvN0h2NT2rdeQ7j1aZ4A7k3za6vO3ldu Cx5o2iqxkgbJ7vIol1RYA70xrKyk5lg= Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Mailerdaemon) with ESMTPSA id 1B311541362; Mon, 1 Sep 2025 03:50:13 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 1 Sep 2025 03:50:12 +0200 From: Linus =?utf-8?Q?L=C3=BCssing?= To: Sven Eckelmann , Martin =?utf-8?Q?Hundeb=C3=B8ll?= Subject: Re: [PATCH 0/2] batman-adv: remove network coding support Message-ID: References: <20250831-drop-catwoman-v1-0-1071bb2a159a@narfation.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20250831-drop-catwoman-v1-0-1071bb2a159a@narfation.org> X-Last-TLS-Session-Version: TLSv1.3 Message-ID-Hash: RGKZXM5GHXLAZQC4BMWPJO3C2R6WM2CM X-Message-ID-Hash: RGKZXM5GHXLAZQC4BMWPJO3C2R6WM2CM X-MailFrom: linus.luessing@c0d3.blue X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; loop; banned-address; header-match-b.a.t.m.a.n.lists.open-mesh.org-0; header-match-b.a.t.m.a.n.lists.open-mesh.org-1; header-match-b.a.t.m.a.n.lists.open-mesh.org-2; emergency; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: b.a.t.m.a.n@lists.open-mesh.org X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.10 Precedence: list List-Id: The list for a Better Approach To Mobile Ad-hoc Networking Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Sun, Aug 31, 2025 at 05:40:00PM +0200, Sven Eckelmann wrote: > This assumption no longer holds for modern wireless mesh networks, which > are heterogeneous and make overhearing increasingly unreliable. .oO(I was wondering if it could be interesting again with IEEE 802.11ah HaLow. Recently read that AREDN mesh had added experimental support in their firmware (though with using Babel, not batman-adv), with ALFA Network Tube-AHM R0C devices. https://www.arednmesh.org/content/aredn-production-release-32580-now-available But testing and tuning HaLow + batman-adv + NC would still be quite some work...) Have had the pleasure to play with this ages ago on 802.11g hardware. It generally semeed to work and was a lot of fun to experiment with. But it wasn't easy to use it reliably, it needed quite some precise placement of nodes. Rate control algorithms wouldn't be aware of network coding opportunities, would have been nice if it had sometimes chosen slower rates for more NC opportunities. (Also CPU usage with promisc mode was maybe an issue back then on many devices? But maybe I misremember that.) I'd maybe try to ask around one more time on Freifunk or Battlemesh channels if anyone would be interested in reviving this, a final call. But as to my knowledge no one has used it in practical scenarios I guess the chances are low. And I agree that it might maybe be better to remove it then in the upstream Linux kernel. Many thanks for the awesome work on this exciting experiment though, Martin! I think it inspired quite some people and contributed to the crazy mesh excitment and pioneering back then that was going on at all fronts. Regards, Linus