From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Ramkumar Ramachandra Subject: Re: [PATCH] po/hi.po: Add Hindi Translation Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2010 13:25:15 +0530 Message-ID: <20100907075509.GA9533@kytes> References: <1283711267-27679-1-git-send-email-artagnon@gmail.com> <20100906042942.GA32387@kytes> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE Cc: Sitaram Chamarty , Git Mailing List , =?iso-8859-1?Q?=C6var_Arnfj=F6r=F0?= , Junio C Hamano To: Antriksh Pany X-From: git-owner@vger.kernel.org Tue Sep 07 09:57:42 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: gcvg-git-2@lo.gmane.org Received: from vger.kernel.org ([209.132.180.67]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Ost3l-0003fu-SD for gcvg-git-2@lo.gmane.org; Tue, 07 Sep 2010 09:57:42 +0200 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1752853Ab0IGH5f convert rfc822-to-quoted-printable (ORCPT ); Tue, 7 Sep 2010 03:57:35 -0400 Received: from mail-px0-f174.google.com ([209.85.212.174]:65441 "EHLO mail-px0-f174.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1751534Ab0IGH5e (ORCPT ); Tue, 7 Sep 2010 03:57:34 -0400 Received: by pxi10 with SMTP id 10so1232848pxi.19 for ; Tue, 07 Sep 2010 00:57:33 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:date:from:to:cc:subject :message-id:references:mime-version:content-type:content-disposition :content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=RMq8WpjjOt54flcJReOyjY5wdCpKV0yyiDAy2l9mAEI=; b=qHlaRNeKsK0y0/EArrVuh2NYLs6Ko+QI7hbtkQOieIjbipETl0uT5uNl9el2mwxWIi qY21Tm9o/k1PZcTPUcJkjwTDHYMb7HFcjvNQ7Ww60ke0+Iyo2ah35kzX+LBUDOztngDg 87qJn2AQLiDR7a41H2EpwwrYjm58scut6ULmM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-type:content-disposition:content-transfer-encoding :in-reply-to:user-agent; b=v5nSsOW13FC9L5W23Bb3wpSnhxo55hM8HdmaMdT43zFc24ySHlHqZ74idbwj0Wxd65 Rc72jaLVgbGIniLK5EXHNpcRIqFkLz58CMo5QREgwxpyUC3dTh5ejP8F3W6y2Re/7JUi 2fT25lovJmhu0YZxE6nTKgtiVWRx5WI8oUdt8= Received: by 10.142.187.20 with SMTP id k20mr624920wff.154.1283846253672; Tue, 07 Sep 2010 00:57:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kytes ([203.110.240.41]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id n36sm5422522wfa.16.2010.09.07.00.57.24 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Tue, 07 Sep 2010 00:57:32 -0700 (PDT) Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14) Sender: git-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: git@vger.kernel.org Archived-At: Hi Antriksh, Antriksh Pany writes: > Nice to see some Hindi around here ;P >=20 > A few comments inline. Thanks for the wonderful feedback! :) > > =C2=A0#, c-format > > =C2=A0msgid "insanely long template name %s" > > -msgstr "=E0=A4=9F=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AA=E0=A4=B2=E0=A5= =87=E0=A4=9F =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=BE=E0=A4=AE =E0=A4=AC=E0= =A4=B9=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=A4 =E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=82=E0=A4=AC=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=B9= =E0=A5=88: %s" > > +msgstr "=E0=A4=9F=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AA=E0=A4=B2=E0=A5= =87=E0=A4=9F %s =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=BE=E0=A4=AE =E0=A4=AC= =E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=A4 =E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=82=E0=A4=AC=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4= =B9=E0=A5=88" > bahut -> atyant? Yes, definitely. =E0=A4=AC=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=A4 did feel out of p= lace here. > > =C2=A0#, c-format > > =C2=A0msgid "insanely long symlink %s" > > -msgstr "=E0=A4=AA=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=A4=E0=A5=80=E0=A4=95=E0=A4= =BE=E0=A4=A4=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AE=E0=A4=95 =E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=82=E0=A4= =95 =E0=A4=AC=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=A4 =E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=82=E0=A4=AC=E0= =A4=BE =E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88: %s" > > +msgstr "=E0=A4=AA=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=A4=E0=A5=80=E0=A4=95=E0=A4= =BE=E0=A4=A4=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AE=E0=A4=95 =E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=82=E0=A4= =95 %s =E0=A4=AC=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=A4 =E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=82=E0=A4=AC= =E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88" > Same suggestion: bahut -> atyant? > Also, dropping the '=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88' might be crisper and closer t= o the English version. Okay. > > =C2=A0#, c-format > > =C2=A0msgid "cannot copy '%s' to '%s'" > > -msgstr "'%s' =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B2 '%s' =E0= =A4=A8=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=80=E0=A4=82 =E0=A4=AC=E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=B8= =E0=A4=95=E0=A5=87" > > +msgstr "'%s' =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=85=E0=A4=A8=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=95= =E0=A5=83=E0=A4=A4=E0=A4=BF '%s' =E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=82 =E0=A4=A8=E0= =A4=B9=E0=A5=80=E0=A4=82 =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B0 =E0=A4=B8=E0=A4=95=E0=A5=87= " > ka -> ki Ah, yes. Gender ambiguity in Hindi. I also felt it should be =E0=A4=95=E0= =A5=80. Can you explain why though? '%s' a noun here; have you chosen it to be feminine? But =E0=A4=85=E0=A4=A8=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=95=E0=A5=83=E0=A4=A4=E0= =A4=BF is a noun as well, and quite obviously feminine. Is that why? > > =C2=A0#, c-format > > =C2=A0msgid "ignoring template %s" > > -msgstr "=E0=A4=9F=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AA=E0=A4=B2=E0=A5= =87=E0=A4=9F =E0=A4=95=E0=A5=8B =E0=A4=89=E0=A4=AA=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=95=E0= =A5=8D=E0=A4=B7=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B0 =E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=87= =E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88: %s" > > +msgstr "=E0=A4=9F=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AA=E0=A4=B2=E0=A5= =87=E0=A4=9F %s =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=89=E0=A4=AA=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=95= =E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=B7=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B0 =E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5= =87 =E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88" > ka -> ki Similar confusion- I'd like an explanation if possible. =E0=A4=89=E0=A4= =AA=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=95=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=B7=E0=A4=BE is a verb, and I'm not sure how it transforms when gender is afflicted on it. I have chosen =E0=A4=9F=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AA=E0=A4=B2= =E0=A5=87=E0=A4=9F to be masculine- do you think it should be feminine? > > =C2=A0#, c-format > > =C2=A0msgid "insanely long template path %s" > > -msgstr "=E0=A4=9F=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AA=E0=A4=B2=E0=A5= =87=E0=A4=9F =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=86=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE=E0=A4=B0 =E0= =A4=AC=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=A4 =E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=82=E0=A4=AC=E0=A4=BE = =E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88: %s" > > +msgstr "=E0=A4=9F=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AA=E0=A4=B2=E0=A5= =87=E0=A4=9F %s =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=86=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE=E0=A4=B0= =E0=A4=AC=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=A4 =E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=82=E0=A4=AC=E0=A4= =BE =E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88" > Again: bahut -> atyant. And again, '=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88' could be drop= ped perhaps. Ok. > > =C2=A0#, c-format > > =C2=A0msgid "not copying templates of a wrong format version %d fro= m '%s'" > > -msgstr "'%s' =E0=A4=B8=E0=A5=87 =E0=A4=97=E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=A4 =E0=A4= =B8=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=B0=E0=A5=82=E0=A4=AA =E0=A4=B8=E0=A4=82=E0=A4= =B8=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=A3 %d =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=9F= =E0=A5=87=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AA=E0=A4=B2=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=9F =E0=A4=A8= =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B2 =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=80=E0=A4=82 =E0=A4=95=E0=A4= =B0 =E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=87 =E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88" > > +msgstr "'%s' =E0=A4=B8=E0=A5=87 =E0=A4=97=E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=A4 =E0=A4= =B8=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=B5=E0=A4=B0=E0=A5=82=E0=A4=AA =E0=A4=B8=E0=A4=82=E0=A4= =B8=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=A3 %d =E0=A4=95=E0=A5=87 =E0=A4=9F= =E0=A5=87=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=AA=E0=A4=B2=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=9F=E0=A5=8D= =E0=A4=B8 =E0=A4=95=E0=A5=87 =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B2 =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4= =B9=E0=A5=80=E0=A4=82 =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B0 =E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=87 =E0= =A4=B9=E0=A5=88" > Had changed =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B2 to =E0=A4=85=E0=A4=A8=E0=A5=81= =E0=A4=95=E0=A5=83=E0=A4=A4=E0=A4=BF earlier. Not doing that here? While =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B2 is definitely the easier word to use,= it's a verb. =E0=A4=85=E0=A4=A8=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=95=E0=A5=83=E0=A4=A4=E0= =A4=BF is a noun on the other hand- I had to introduce it into the previous sentence because "Make a =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B2 of X in Y" would b= e technically incorrect. > > =C2=A0#, c-format > > =C2=A0msgid "insane git directory %s" > > -msgstr "=E0=A4=96=E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=BE=E0=A4=AC =E0=A4=97=E0=A4=BF=E0= =A4=9F =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B0=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=A6=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=B6=E0= =A4=BF=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE %s" > > +msgstr "%s =E0=A4=96=E0=A4=B0=E0=A4=BE=E0=A4=AC =E0=A4=97=E0=A4=BF= =E0=A4=9F =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=B0=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=A6=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=B6= =E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=88" > I think the first one was better. Ok. > Having gone through this, I find it hard to think that anyone is > really going to use the Hindi translation. Any Indian who would be > involved with git would almost certainly be involved with it in the > English language, particularly given that some of the Hindi words are > fairly hard to follow. Also, when it comes to the Sciences (and in > particular, Computers) Indians (at least the Hindi speaking > population) have directly adopted the English versions instead of > seeking appropriate Hindi ones. I understand. > If we are going to have a hindi.po, I think it may be altogether > better to drop the unusual Hindi words, and literally use the English > word written in Hindi.. the way you did for words like 'templates', > 'link' etc. Other candidates could be 'directory', 'format', > 'version', 'copy', 'symbolic (link)', 'group', 'read', 'write'. I kno= w > that translation for the last few words are not complicated. However, > the subtle meanings of these words in the context of computers gets > lost when translated in Hindi. (For example, 'read' and 'write', whil= e > being similar to real-life usage, have in fact taken very specific > meanings in the context of computer science.) A number of my friends pointed out the same thing. I don't completely agree though. In my opinion, the translations are really just fun, and give the user a warm feeling- it's quite unlikely that a person (atleast Indian) who doesn't understand English will use Git in the first place. Personally, I find English words written in Devanagiri script quite annoying: there is really no elegance or point in translating "Could not stat copy of symbolic link" to "=E0=A4=B8=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=AE=E0=A5=8D= =E0=A4=AC=E0=A5=8B=E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=95 =E0=A4=B2=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=82= =E0=A4=95 =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE =E0=A4=95=E0=A5=89=E0=A4=AA=E0=A5=80 =E0=A4= =B8=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=9F=E0=A4=BE=E0=A4=9F =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=B9=E0=A5=80=E0=A4= =82 =E0=A4=95=E0=A4=B0 =E0=A4=B8=E0=A4=95=E0=A5=87". A person who uses hi.po is doing it mainl= y for recreational purposes, and we'd like to give that person a beautiful and elegant experience, instead of dumbly writing all the nouns in Devanagiri script and inserting a few trivial filler verbs. While I probably took this too far with words like =E0=A4=A8=E0=A4=BF=E0= =A4=B0=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=A6=E0=A5=87=E0=A4=B6=E0=A4=BF=E0=A4=95=E0=A4=BE, = I'd like to be able to find some kind of compromise- I'll submit another revision shortly using a combination of real Hindi words, English words written in Devanagiri script, and English words expressed plainly (like "[stat]"). I wasn't joking when I said that I don't know Hindi. I've never used applications that speak anything but English, and have never been involved with translation before. Thanks for poking- I'll email some Indians involved with translation projects hi.po and ask them for feedback. Thanks. -- Ram