From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Jonathan Nieder Subject: Re: [RFC/PATCH 0/7] Rework git core for native submodules Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2013 11:47:30 -0700 Message-ID: <20130404184730.GL30308@google.com> References: <1365100243-13676-1-git-send-email-artagnon@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cc: Git List , Junio C Hamano , Linus Torvalds To: Ramkumar Ramachandra X-From: git-owner@vger.kernel.org Thu Apr 04 20:48:06 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: gcvg-git-2@plane.gmane.org Received: from vger.kernel.org ([209.132.180.67]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1UNpCf-0006WX-MN for gcvg-git-2@plane.gmane.org; Thu, 04 Apr 2013 20:48:06 +0200 Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1762752Ab3DDSrg (ORCPT ); Thu, 4 Apr 2013 14:47:36 -0400 Received: from mail-pa0-f51.google.com ([209.85.220.51]:62818 "EHLO mail-pa0-f51.google.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1761312Ab3DDSrf (ORCPT ); Thu, 4 Apr 2013 14:47:35 -0400 Received: by mail-pa0-f51.google.com with SMTP id jh10so1625541pab.10 for ; Thu, 04 Apr 2013 11:47:35 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=x-received:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-type:content-disposition:in-reply-to :user-agent; bh=KcpepHTtyV01cDOcn/Vg1xGGyv2H12GdOQZkj7cCxts=; b=osl9tb8diaNg21MB43qfGt8Tmun9dKyk0yBfMEyZAKFISsDRlaM0mtv6XkYp+dOpkY +6ZE1zmZAAf18Al7Q8L+IIsqch1lNlrY6zG2jyo09otfKcPbqENmmOjC2XEOcgE4QlOT 2NAhCidPMmFW1cjVgi6W/qzi98Zc2AN6u4bujHSx5QxdUrqAcH7/5VMDhgm8qn3JGx6Y 6w2u6z7YlHafVZI/rKfoDxRtv44h9IrqQfiag8Sc4A86ZWUcO3W5zA9qWPX51kWc20o5 DhgLwpRBesg3GC7F/sPME0Yxh58j+7l97oll7uHcIm/CVN8+wTBDxgizSZrdy8Sjs5e0 SHSw== X-Received: by 10.66.246.168 with SMTP id xx8mr10999115pac.107.1365101255428; Thu, 04 Apr 2013 11:47:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from google.com ([2620:0:1000:5b00:b6b5:2fff:fec3:b50d]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id lb8sm12476427pab.13.2013.04.04.11.47.33 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Thu, 04 Apr 2013 11:47:34 -0700 (PDT) Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1365100243-13676-1-git-send-email-artagnon@gmail.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Sender: git-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: git@vger.kernel.org Archived-At: Ramkumar Ramachandra wrote: > The purpose of this series is to convince you that we've made a lot of > fundamental mistakes while designing submodules, and that we should > fix them now. [1/7] argues for a new object type, and this is the > core of the idea. Oh, dear. Shouldn't it be possible to explain the same thing using a test script illustrating intended UI? [...] > $ git clone gh:artagnon/varlog > $ cd varlog > $ git clone gh:artagnon/clayoven > # Notice how it puts clayoven.git in ~/bare I really would like to be able to continue doing something like git clone --recurse-submodules git://repo.or.cz/cgit.git # never mind! rm -fr cgit without leaving any clutter behind. I have used systems that kept state in my home directory before and found them a pain in the neck to debug. Others may disagree, though. [...] > # Again, just works! No cd-to-toplevel nonsense Didn't Jens mention that git-submodule requiring that one work at the toplevel is just a (presumably easily fixable) bug? [...] > If you think this is all a big waste of time, and that we should focus > on improving git-submodule.sh, you're probably deranged. Because it's I don't think that *you* should focus on improving git-submodule, as long as you are not using it and dislike its design. But I do think it's strange to at the same time 1) tell me I'm deranged for liking submodules 2) dismiss other experiments that have been created as alternatives I like experimentation, which means sometimes having tools whose purposes overlap, and I like when it's possible to help something evolve to be better, even far enough to interoperate with or replace uses of another tool. I also believe in "live and let live". That means that even if someone is a little crazy, if they are not actively harmful, I do not destroy their tools. That probably marks me as deranged. Hope that helps, Jonathan