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[62.194.98.111]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id t44-v6sm7183817edb.79.2018.08.06.10.39.39 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Mon, 06 Aug 2018 10:39:40 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?B?w4Z2YXIgQXJuZmrDtnLDsA==?= Bjarmason To: Jeff King Cc: Junio C Hamano , Duy Nguyen , Jonathan Nieder , Stefan Beller , Git Mailing List , git-packagers@googlegroups.com, Han-Wen Nienhuys Subject: Re: [PATCH] Makefile: enable DEVELOPER by default References: <20180804020009.224582-1-sbeller@google.com> <20180804020255.225573-1-sbeller@google.com> <20180804060928.GB55869@aiede.svl.corp.google.com> <87zhxzsb2p.fsf@evledraar.gmail.com> <20180806170211.GD19053@sigill.intra.peff.net> User-agent: Debian GNU/Linux testing (buster); Emacs 25.2.2; mu4e 1.1.0 In-reply-to: <20180806170211.GD19053@sigill.intra.peff.net> a--text follows this line-- Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2018 19:39:35 +0200 Message-ID: <87y3djs8bs.fsf@evledraar.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: git-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: git@vger.kernel.org On Mon, Aug 06 2018, Jeff King wrote: > On Mon, Aug 06, 2018 at 06:40:14PM +0200, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote: > >> Responding to the thread in general, perhaps people would like this more >> if we turned DEVELOPER=1 DEVOPTS=no-error on by default? >> >> That's basically why I added it in 99f763baf5 ("Makefile: add a DEVOPTS >> to suppress -Werror under DEVELOPER", 2018-04-14), because I wanted the >> abilty to have verbose informative output without the build dying on >> some older systems / compilers. >> >> It's fine and understandable if you're someone who's just building a >> package on some older system if you get a bunch of compiler warnings, >> but more annoying if you have to dig into how to disable a default >> -Werror. > > I had the impression that DEVELOPER=1 was allowed to set flags that old > versions might not even know about. Hence they might actually barf, even > without -Werror. Maybe that's better since the introduction of the > detect-compiler script, though. I misrecalled that -Wimadethis-up wouldn't error on e.g. GCC today in the interest of forward-compatibility, but it does. So that changes things. Although we could today pick some set of flags greater than what we use today if there's interest, and enough compiler compatibility. > I do think we may have a skewed view of the population on this list. > We're developers ourselves, and we interact with new developers that we > want to help. But there are masses of people[1] building Git who are > _not_ developers, and want the default to be as robust as possible. > They're probably not going to show up in this thread. Indeed.