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* Eyestrain problems with new Intel drivers
@ 2014-01-09 23:30 Michael Vanier
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 4+ messages in thread
From: Michael Vanier @ 2014-01-09 23:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: intel-gfx

Hi everyone,

I recently got a new Macbook Pro, which I dual-booted into Ubuntu 13.10 
(Linux kernel 3.11).  My previous computers were from 2008 and used ATI 
or Nvidia graphics cards.  The new one (with Intel HD 4000 integrated 
graphics, core i7, no other graphics card) seems to cause me a lot of 
eyestrain compared to what I'm used to. The experience I have is that 
light surfaces appear to shimmer in a way that didn't used to happen, 
and this shimmering seems to be related to the eyestrain.  After about 
an hour I really don't want to use the computer anymore; it's like a 
burning/sore feeling in the eyes coupled with dry eyes.  It's not a 
monitor problem, because I can hook up the Macbook to an old monitor 
which works perfectly well with old hardware (no eyestrain) and the 
eyestrain is still there. So it would appear to be due to the graphics 
hardware/driver combination.  It's also not Intel-specific or 
OS-specific; I've seen the same effect on Mac OS X and using different 
video cards; it seems to be the new normal.  I'm really confused about 
what could be causing this.  Resolutions don't matter; you always get 
the eyestrain.  My first thought was temporal dithering (or 
spatiotemporal dithering), but my reading of the intel driver source is 
that the kernel drivers have disabled ST dithering in favor of spatial 
dithering.  I have seen a few people report similar problems in mailing 
lists (including this one), and some of them got some relief by 
disabling the DRI/DRI2 extension in Xorg (this was around 2010), which 
doesn't seem to do much for me (nor does switching to the modesetting 
driver or fbdev driver). (Interestingly, using modesetting/fbdev drivers 
doesn't seem to slow down glxgears either, which always claims to run 
around 1700 FPS).  Some people got relief by switching to the Vesa 
driver, which my Xorg won't accept; it just unloads it and reloads the 
Intel driver.  Interestingly, the eyestrain is present even before X 
loads up or if you don't load X at all; when the system boots you can 
see very flat-looking text (which I think is OK) and then it switches to 
a more shimmering kind of text (presumably when the intel driver kicks 
in).  You would think plain text would have absolutely constant pixel 
values, but that isn't what I see (except on old hardware).

I'm sure that 99% of people can't notice this, but for the 1% who can 
it's a huge pain.  I'm on another mailing list with dozens of other 
people with similar problems, so it isn't just me.  If anyone has any 
suggestions as to what I/we can try (not eyedrops, I mean software 
stuff) or where I can look, I'd be really grateful.  I've had my eyes 
checked recently and they're fine.

Thanks!

Mike

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 4+ messages in thread

* Re: Eyestrain problems with new Intel drivers
       [not found] <CALN9Hsuy7=GhDsye_wm15SZ-forGLfJ-pVEB_-zraQx_93MS+g@mail.gmail.com>
@ 2014-03-31  8:05 ` Janus
  2014-04-01 11:14   ` Felix Miata
       [not found]   ` <CALN9Hsvpq78A-ygxya=XXJZx9LLUT2qodBZgQ2ZACHTyMWZfiw@mail.gmail.com>
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 4+ messages in thread
From: Janus @ 2014-03-31  8:05 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: intel-gfx

Dear developers,

I have the same problem as the one described by Michael bellow: the
Intel Graphic card produces eye strain and headache after some minutes
of using it. I found a lot of people complaining on the same problem,
but no solution. I tried lowering the resolution, increasing the PWM
frequency, but without luck. I also installed an old version of intel
drivers (2.20.12), because the subject of this email was "with **new**
Intel drivers", but it didn't help.

I have a new HP Folio 9470m, with the Intel HD 4000 graphic card, and
I cannot use it. Even when connecting an external monitor, I have the
same problem. When I connect my old laptop, with an nvidia card, to
the same monitor, the eyestrain disapear, so it must be the Intel
card, or its driver.

I will be glad to provide any information you consider relevant. I can
do whatever test you want, but please, do not ignore this message. I
am not the only one to have this problem:
https://www.google.com/search?q=Eye+strain+Intel+graphic

I am on (Arch) Linux, but I saw some reports on Windows too.

Best,
Alejandro

On Mon, Jan 9, 2014 at 3:30 PM, Michael Vanier wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I recently got a new Macbook Pro, which I dual-booted into Ubuntu
> 13.10 (Linux kernel 3.11). My previous computers were from 2008 and
> used ATI or Nvidia graphics cards. The new one (with Intel HD 4000
> integrated graphics, core i7, no other graphics card) seems to cause
> me a lot of eyestrain compared to what I'm used to. The experience I
> have is that light surfaces appear to shimmer in a way that didn't
> used to happen, and this shimmering seems to be related to the
> eyestrain. After about an hour I really don't want to use the computer
> anymore; it's like a burning/sore feeling in the eyes coupled with dry
> eyes. It's not a monitor problem, because I can hook up the Macbook to
> an old monitor which works perfectly well with old hardware (no
> eyestrain) and the eyestrain is still there. So it would appear to be
> due to the graphics hardware/driver combination. It's also not
> Intel-specific or OS-specific; I've seen the same effect on Mac OS X
> and using different video cards; it seems to be the new normal. I'm
> really confused about what could be causing this. Resolutions don't
> matter; you always get the eyestrain. My first thought was temporal
> dithering (or spatiotemporal dithering), but my reading of the intel
> driver source is that the kernel drivers have disabled ST dithering in
> favor of spatial dithering. I have seen a few people report similar
> problems in mailing lists (including this one), and some of them got
> some relief by disabling the DRI/DRI2 extension in Xorg (this was
> around 2010), which doesn't seem to do much for me (nor does switching
> to the modesetting driver or fbdev driver). (Interestingly, using
> modesetting/fbdev drivers doesn't seem to slow down glxgears either,
> which always claims to run around 1700 FPS). Some people got relief by
> switching to the Vesa driver, which my Xorg won't accept; it just
> unloads it and reloads the Intel driver. Interestingly, the eyestrain
> is present even before X loads up or if you don't load X at all; when
> the system boots you can see very flat-looking text (which I think is
> OK) and then it switches to a more shimmering kind of text (presumably
> when the intel driver kicks in). You would think plain text would have
> absolutely constant pixel values, but that isn't what I see (except on
> old hardware). I'm sure that 99% of people can't notice this, but for
> the 1% who can it's a huge pain. I'm on another mailing list with
> dozens of other people with similar problems, so it isn't just me. If
> anyone has any suggestions as to what I/we can try (not eyedrops, I
> mean software stuff) or where I can look, I'd be really grateful. I've
> had my eyes checked recently and they're fine.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> Intel-gfx mailing list
> Intel-gfx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/intel-gfx



-- 
Alejandro Díaz-Caro
http://diaz-caro.info

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 4+ messages in thread

* Re: Eyestrain problems with new Intel drivers
  2014-03-31  8:05 ` Janus
@ 2014-04-01 11:14   ` Felix Miata
       [not found]   ` <CALN9Hsvpq78A-ygxya=XXJZx9LLUT2qodBZgQ2ZACHTyMWZfiw@mail.gmail.com>
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 4+ messages in thread
From: Felix Miata @ 2014-04-01 11:14 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: intel-gfx

On 2014-03-31 10:05 (GMT+0200) Janus composed:

> I have the same problem as the one described by Michael bellow: the
> Intel Graphic card produces eye strain and headache after some minutes
> of using it. I found a lot of people complaining on the same problem,
> but no solution. I tried lowering the resolution, increasing the PWM
> frequency, but without luck. I also installed an old version of intel
> drivers (2.20.12), because the subject of this email was "with **new**
> Intel drivers", but it didn't help.

> I have a new HP Folio 9470m, with the Intel HD 4000 graphic card, and
> I cannot use it. Even when connecting an external monitor, I have the
> same problem. When I connect my old laptop, with an nvidia card, to
> the same monitor, the eyestrain disapear, so it must be the Intel
> card, or its driver.

> I will be glad to provide any information you consider relevant. I can
> do whatever test you want, but please, do not ignore this message. I
> am not the only one to have this problem:
> https://www.google.com/search?q=Eye+strain+Intel+graphic

> I am on (Arch) Linux, but I saw some reports on Windows too.

What is output from 'lspci | grep VGA'?
Exactly what model is your external display?
Does disabling compositing help?
Is it better if you boot a Live Linux media from a year or two or three ago, 
e.g. Knoppix 7.0.5 or openSUSE 12.3 or Mageia 2 or Fedora 18?

> On Mon, Jan 9, 2014 at 3:30 PM, Michael Vanier wrote:

http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/intel-gfx/2014-January/038104.html
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 4+ messages in thread

* Re: Eyestrain problems with new Intel drivers
       [not found]   ` <CALN9Hsvpq78A-ygxya=XXJZx9LLUT2qodBZgQ2ZACHTyMWZfiw@mail.gmail.com>
@ 2014-04-17 16:22     ` Alejandro Díaz-Caro
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 4+ messages in thread
From: Alejandro Díaz-Caro @ 2014-04-17 16:22 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: intel-gfx


[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2455 bytes --]

On Thu, Apr 01, 2014 Felix Miata wrote:
> On 2014-03-31 10:05 (GMT+0200) Janus composed:
>> I have the same problem as the one described by Michael bellow: the
>> Intel Graphic card produces eye strain and headache after some minutes
>> of using it. I found a lot of people complaining on the same problem,
>> but no solution. I tried lowering the resolution, increasing the PWM
>> frequency, but without luck. I also installed an old version of intel
>> drivers (2.20.12), because the subject of this email was "with **new**
>> Intel drivers", but it didn't help.
>>
>> I have a new HP Folio 9470m, with the Intel HD 4000 graphic card, and
>> I cannot use it. Even when connecting an external monitor, I have the
>> same problem. When I connect my old laptop, with an nvidia card, to
>> the same monitor, the eyestrain disapear, so it must be the Intel
>> card, or its driver.
>>
>> I will be glad to provide any information you consider relevant. I can
>> do whatever test you want, but please, do not ignore this message. I
>> am not the only one to have this problem:
>> https://www.google.com/search?q=Eye+strain+Intel+graphic
>>
>> I am on (Arch) Linux, but I saw some reports on Windows too.
>
> What is output from 'lspci | grep VGA'?

$ lspci -v -s 00:02.0
00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 3rd Gen Core processor
Graphics Controller (rev 09) (prog-if 00 [VGA controller])
Subsystem: Hewlett-Packard Company Device 18df
Flags: bus master, fast devsel, latency 0, IRQ 49
Memory at d0000000 (64-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=4M]
Memory at c0000000 (64-bit, prefetchable) [size=256M]
I/O ports at 2000 [size=64]
Expansion ROM at <unassigned> [disabled]
Capabilities: <access denied>
Kernel driver in use: i915
Kernel modules: i915

> Exactly what model is your external display?

It is an HP. I do not have access to it now (it is in my office, I can give
you the details on Monday).

> Does disabling compositing help?

No, it doesn't.

> Is it better if you boot a Live Linux media from a year or two or
> three ago, e.g. Knoppix 7.0.5 or openSUSE 12.3 or Mageia 2 or Fedora
> 18?

I tested with openSUSE 12.3, but I had the same problem.

Thank you for your suggestions. Any other idea?

On Mon, Jan 9, 2014 at 3:30 PM, Michael Vanier wrote:
> http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/intel-gfx/2014-January/038104.html

-- 

Alejandro Díaz-Caro
http://diaz-caro.info

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 4+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2014-04-17 16:22 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 4+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2014-01-09 23:30 Eyestrain problems with new Intel drivers Michael Vanier
     [not found] <CALN9Hsuy7=GhDsye_wm15SZ-forGLfJ-pVEB_-zraQx_93MS+g@mail.gmail.com>
2014-03-31  8:05 ` Janus
2014-04-01 11:14   ` Felix Miata
     [not found]   ` <CALN9Hsvpq78A-ygxya=XXJZx9LLUT2qodBZgQ2ZACHTyMWZfiw@mail.gmail.com>
2014-04-17 16:22     ` Alejandro Díaz-Caro

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