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From: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>
To: Sean Christopherson <seanjc@google.com>
Cc: Dongli Zhang <dongli.zhang@oracle.com>,
	David Woodhouse <dwmw2@infradead.org>,
	Joe Jin <joe.jin@oracle.com>,
	x86@kernel.org, kvm@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, pbonzini@redhat.com,
	tglx@linutronix.de, mingo@redhat.com, bp@alien8.de,
	dave.hansen@linux.intel.com
Subject: Re: [PATCH RFC 1/1] KVM: x86: add param to update master clock periodically
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2023 23:16:51 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20231002211651.GA3774@noisy.programming.kicks-ass.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20231002210607.GD27267@noisy.programming.kicks-ass.net>

On Mon, Oct 02, 2023 at 11:06:07PM +0200, Peter Zijlstra wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 02, 2023 at 11:18:50AM -0700, Sean Christopherson wrote:
> > +PeterZ
> > 
> > Thomas and Peter,
> > 
> > We're trying to address an issue where KVM's paravirt kvmclock drifts from the
> > host's TSC-based monotonic raw clock because of historical reasons (at least, AFAICT),
> > even when the TSC is constant.  Due to some dubious KVM behavior, KVM may sometimes
> > re-sync kvmclock against the host's monotonic raw clock, which causes non-trivial
> > jumps in time from the guest's perspective.
> > 
> > Linux-as-a-guest demotes all paravirt clock sources when the TSC is constant and
> > nonstop, and so the goofy KVM behavior isn't likely to affect the guest's clocksource,
> > but the guest's sched_clock() implementation keeps using the paravirt clock.
> > 
> > Irrespective of if/how we fix the KVM host-side mess, using a paravirt clock for
> > the scheduler when using a constant, nonstop TSC for the clocksource seems at best
> > inefficient, and at worst unnecessarily complex and risky.
> > 
> > Is there any reason not to prefer native_sched_clock() over whatever paravirt
> > clock is present when the TSC is the preferred clocksource? 
> 
> I see none, that whole pv_clock thing is horrible crap.

In fact, I don't really see a reason to ever use pv_clock, even on
non-constant TSC. The sched_clock machinery used on x86 (and ia64 at
some point) reverts to tick-based + 'TSC-with-monotonicity-filter
refinement' once it detects the TSC is crap.

And that should work in a guest too I suppose.

Also, I really should clean all that up -- it's all static_key based,
but I think I can do a saner version with static_call. But that's stuck
somewhere on the eternal todo list.

  reply	other threads:[~2023-10-02 21:17 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 44+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2023-09-26 23:06 [PATCH RFC 1/1] KVM: x86: add param to update master clock periodically Dongli Zhang
2023-09-27  0:29 ` Joe Jin
2023-09-27  0:36   ` Dongli Zhang
2023-09-28 16:18     ` Sean Christopherson
2023-09-29 20:15       ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-02  8:33         ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-02 16:37           ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-02 17:17             ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-02 18:18               ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-02 21:06                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2023-10-02 21:16                   ` Peter Zijlstra [this message]
2023-10-02 18:16             ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-03  0:53               ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-03  1:32                 ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-03  1:49                   ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-03  2:07                     ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-03 21:00                       ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-03  5:54                 ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-04  0:04                   ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-04 10:01                     ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-04 18:06                       ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-04 19:13                         ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-11  0:20                           ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-11  7:18                             ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-13 18:07                               ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-13 18:21                                 ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-13 19:02                                   ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-13 19:12                                     ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-13 20:03                                       ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-13 20:12                                 ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-13 23:26                                   ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-14  9:49                                     ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-16 15:47                                       ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-16 16:25                                         ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-16 17:04                                           ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-16 18:49                                           ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-16 22:04                                             ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-16 22:48                                               ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-17 16:18                                                 ` Dongli Zhang
2023-10-03  9:12                 ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-04  0:07                   ` Sean Christopherson
2023-10-04  8:06                     ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-03 14:29                 ` David Woodhouse
2023-10-04  0:10                   ` Sean Christopherson

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