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From: Gregory Haskins <gregory.haskins@gmail.com>
To: Anthony Liguori <anthony@codemonkey.ws>
Cc: alacrityvm-devel@lists.sourceforge.net,
	Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu>,
	kvm@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	Gregory Haskins <ghaskins@novell.com>
Subject: Re: vbus design points: shm and shm-signals
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2009 17:28:47 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4A93060F.10506@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4A92F158.9050003@gmail.com>

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Gregory Haskins wrote:
> Anthony Liguori wrote:
>> Fundamentally, how is this different than the virtio->add_buf concept?
> 
> From my POV, they are at different levels.  Calling vbus->shm() is for
> establishing a shared-memory region including routing the memory and
> signal-path contexts.  You do this once at device init time, and then
> run some algorithm on top (such as a virtqueue design).
> 
> virtio->add_buf() OTOH, is a run-time function.  You do this to modify
> the shared-memory region that is already established at init time by
> something like vbus->shm().  You would do this to queue a network
> packet, for instance.
> 
> That said, shm-signal's closest analogy to virtio would be vq->kick(),
> vq->callback(), vq->enable_cb(), and vq->disable_cb().  The difference
> is that the notification mechanism isn't associated with a particular
> type of shared-memory construct (such as a virt-queue), but instead can
> be used with any shared-mem algorithm (at least, if I designed it properly).
> 
> The closest analogy for vbus->shm() to virtio would be
> vdev->config->find_vqs().  Again, the difference is that the algorithm
> (ring, etc) is not dictated by the call.  You then overlay something
> like virtqueue on top.

BTW: Another way to think of this is that virtio->add_buf() is really
"buffer assignment", whereas "vbus->shm()" is "buffer sharing".  The
former is meant to follow an "assign, consume, re-assign, reclaim"
model, where the changing pointer ownership implicitly serializes the
writability of the buffer.  Its used (quite effectively) for things like
passing a network-packet around.

Conversely, the latter case ("buffer sharing") is designed for
concurrent writers.  Its used for things like ring-metadata,
shared-table designs, etc.  Anything that generally is designed for a
longer-term, parallel update model, instead of a consume/reclaim model.

Whether we realize it or not, we generally build buffer-assignment
algorithms on top of buffer-sharing algorithms.  Therefore, while virtio
technically has both of these components, it only exposes the former
(buffer-assignment) as a user-extensible ABI (vq->add_buf).  The latter
(buffer-sharing) is inextricably linked to the underlying virtqueue ABI
(vdev->find_vqs) (or, at least it is today).

This is why I keep emphasizing that they are different layers of the
same stack.  From a device point of view, virtio adds a robust ring
model with buffer-assignment capabilities, support for scatter-gather,
etc.  Vbus underneath it provides a robust buffer-sharing design with
considerations for things like end-to-end prioritization, mitigation of
various virt-like inefficiencies (hypercalls, interrupts, eois, spurious
re-signals), etc.

The idea is you can then join the two together to do something like
build 8-rx virtqueues for your virtio-net to support prio.  If you take
these things into consideration on the backend design as well, you can
actually tie it in end-to-end to gain performance and capabilities not
previously available in KVM (or possibly any virt platform).

HTH,

Kind Regards,
-Greg


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  reply	other threads:[~2009-08-24 21:28 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 119+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <20090814154125.26116.70709.stgit@dev.haskins.net>
     [not found] ` <20090814154308.26116.46980.stgit@dev.haskins.net>
2009-08-15 10:32   ` [PATCH v3 3/6] vbus: add a "vbus-proxy" bus model for vbus_driver objects Ingo Molnar
2009-08-15 19:15     ` Anthony Liguori
2009-08-16  7:16       ` Ingo Molnar
2009-08-17 13:54         ` Anthony Liguori
2009-08-17 14:23           ` Ingo Molnar
2009-08-17 14:14       ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-17 14:58         ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-17 15:05           ` Ingo Molnar
2009-08-17 17:41         ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-17 20:17           ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-18  8:46             ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 15:19               ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-18 16:25                 ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 15:53               ` [Alacrityvm-devel] " Ira W. Snyder
2009-08-18 16:51                 ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 17:27                   ` Ira W. Snyder
2009-08-18 17:47                     ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 18:27                       ` Ira W. Snyder
2009-08-18 18:52                         ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 20:59                           ` Ira W. Snyder
2009-08-18 21:26                             ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 22:06                               ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19  0:44                                 ` Ira W. Snyder
2009-08-19  5:26                                   ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19  0:38                               ` Ira W. Snyder
2009-08-19  5:40                                 ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 15:28                                   ` Ira W. Snyder
2009-08-19 15:37                                     ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 16:29                                       ` Ira W. Snyder
2009-08-19 16:38                                         ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 21:05                                           ` Hollis Blanchard
2009-08-20  9:57                                             ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2009-08-20 10:08                                               ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 20:35                         ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 21:04                           ` Arnd Bergmann
2009-08-18 20:39                     ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 20:57                 ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 23:24                   ` Ira W. Snyder
2009-08-18  1:08         ` Anthony Liguori
2009-08-18  7:38           ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18  8:54           ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 13:16           ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-18 13:45             ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 15:51               ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-18 16:14                 ` Ingo Molnar
2009-08-19  4:27                   ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19  5:22                     ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 13:27                       ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19 14:35                         ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-21 10:55                     ` vbus design points: shm and shm-signals Gregory Haskins
2009-08-24 19:02                       ` Anthony Liguori
2009-08-24 20:00                         ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-24 21:28                           ` Gregory Haskins [this message]
2009-08-24 23:57                           ` Anthony Liguori
2009-08-25  0:10                             ` Anthony Liguori
2009-08-18 16:47                 ` [PATCH v3 3/6] vbus: add a "vbus-proxy" bus model for vbus_driver objects Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 16:51                 ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-19  5:36                   ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19  5:48                     ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19  6:40                       ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19  7:13                         ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 11:40                           ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19 11:49                             ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 11:52                               ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19 14:33                     ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-20 12:12                     ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-16  8:30     ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-17 14:16       ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-17 14:59         ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-17 15:09           ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-17 15:14             ` Ingo Molnar
2009-08-17 19:35               ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-17 15:18             ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-17 13:02     ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-17 14:25       ` Ingo Molnar
2009-08-17 15:05         ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-17 15:08           ` Ingo Molnar
2009-08-17 19:33             ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-18  8:33               ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 14:46                 ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-18 16:27                   ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19  6:28                     ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19  7:11                       ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 18:23                         ` Nicholas A. Bellinger
2009-08-19 18:39                           ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19 19:19                             ` Nicholas A. Bellinger
2009-08-19 19:34                               ` Nicholas A. Bellinger
2009-08-19 20:12                           ` configfs/sysfs Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 20:48                             ` configfs/sysfs Ingo Molnar
2009-08-19 20:53                               ` configfs/sysfs Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 21:19                             ` configfs/sysfs Nicholas A. Bellinger
2009-08-19 22:15                             ` configfs/sysfs Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19 22:16                             ` configfs/sysfs Joel Becker
2009-08-19 23:48                               ` [Alacrityvm-devel] configfs/sysfs Alex Tsariounov
2009-08-19 23:54                               ` configfs/sysfs Nicholas A. Bellinger
2009-08-20  6:09                               ` configfs/sysfs Avi Kivity
2009-08-20 22:48                                 ` configfs/sysfs Joel Becker
2009-08-21  4:14                                   ` configfs/sysfs Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 18:26                         ` [PATCH v3 3/6] vbus: add a "vbus-proxy" bus model for vbus_driver objects Gregory Haskins
2009-08-19 20:37                           ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19 20:53                             ` Ingo Molnar
2009-08-20 17:25                             ` Muli Ben-Yehuda
2009-08-20 20:58                             ` Caitlin Bestler
2009-08-18 18:20                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2009-08-18 19:08                     ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-19  5:36                     ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-18  9:53               ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 10:00                 ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 10:09                   ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 10:13                     ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 10:28                       ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 10:45                         ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 11:07                           ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 11:15                             ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 11:49                               ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-18 11:54                                 ` Avi Kivity
2009-08-18 15:39                 ` Gregory Haskins
2009-08-18 16:39                   ` Michael S. Tsirkin
2009-08-17 15:13           ` Avi Kivity

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