Re: [RFC] Unify KVM kernel-space and user-space code into a single project

Ingo Molnar
2010-03-18T13:48:13Z

* Frank Ch. Eigler <fche@redhat.com> wrote:

> Hi -
>
> > > > [...]
> > > > Distributions are very eager to update kernels even in stable periods of the
> > > > distro lifetime - they are much less willing to update user-space packages.
> > > > [...]
> > >
> > > Sorry, er, what? What distributions eagerly upgrade kernels in stable
> > > periods, were it not primarily motivated by security fixes? [...]
> >
> > Please check the popular distro called 'Fedora' for example
>
> I do believe I've heard of it. According to fedora bodhi, there have
> been 18 kernel updates issues for fedora 11 since its release, of
> which 12 were for purely security updates, and most of the other six
> also contain security fixes. None are described as 'enhancement'
> updates. Oh, what about fedora 12? 8 updates total, of which 5 are
> security only, one for drm showstoppers, others including security
> fixes, again 0 tagged as 'enhancement'.
>
> So where is that "eagerness" again?? My sense is that most users are
> happy to leave a stable kernel running as long as possible, and
> distributions know this. You surely must understand that the lkml
> demographics are different.
>
> > and its kernel upgrade policies.
>
> [citation needed]

You are quite wrong, despite the sarcastic tone you are attempting to use, and
this is distro kernel policy 101.

For distros such as Fedora it's simpler to support the same kernel version
across many older versions of the distro than having to support different
kernel versions.

Check Fedora 12 for example. Four months ago it was released with kernel
v2.6.31:

http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/releases/12/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/kernel-2.6.31.5-127.fc12.x86_64.rpm

But if you update a Fedora 12 installation today you'll get kernel v2.6.32:

http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/updates/12/SRPMS/kernel-2.6.32.9-70.fc12.src.rpm

As a result you'll get a new 2.6.32 kernel on Fedora 12.

The end result is what i said in the previous mail: that you'll get a newer
kernel even on a stable distro - while user-space packages will only be
updated if there's a security issue (and even then there's no version jump
like for the kernel).

> > > [...] What users eagerly replace their kernels?
> >
> > Those 99% who click on the 'install 193 updates' popup.
>
> That's not "eager". That's "I'm exasperated from guessing what's really
> important; let's not have so many updates; meh".

Erm, fact is, 99% [WAG] of the users click on the update button and accept
whatever kernel version the distro update offers them.

Ingo