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From: Dan Magenheimer <dan.magenheimer@oracle.com>
To: Avi Kivity <avi@redhat.com>
Cc: Sasha Levin <levinsasha928@gmail.com>,
	mtosatti@redhat.com, gregkh@linuxfoundation.org,
	sjenning@linux.vnet.ibm.com, Konrad Wilk <konrad.wilk@oracle.com>,
	kvm@vger.kernel.org
Subject: RE: [RFC 00/10] KVM: Add TMEM host/guest support
Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2012 09:40:36 -0700 (PDT)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4d71487c-470c-4f48-b6f3-e590a901c837@default> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4FD7156A.8050207@redhat.com>

> From: Avi Kivity [mailto:avi@redhat.com]
> Subject: Re: [RFC 00/10] KVM: Add TMEM host/guest support

I started off with a point-by-point comment on most of your
responses about the tradeoffs of how tmem works, but decided
it best to simply say we disagree and kvm-tmem will need to
prove who is right.

> >> Sorry, no, first demonstrate no performance regressions, then we can
> >> talk about performance improvements.
> >
> > Well that's an awfully hard bar to clear, even with any of the many
> > changes being merged every release into the core Linux mm subsystem.
> > Any change to memory management will have some positive impacts on some
> > workloads and some negative impacts on others.
> 
> Right, that's too harsh.  But these benchmarks show a doubling (or even
> more) of cpu overhead, and that is whether the cache is effective or
> not.  That is simply way too much to consider.

One point here... remember you have contrived a worst case
scenario.  The one case Sasha provided outside of that contrived
worst case, as you commented, looks very nice.  So the costs/benefits
remain to be seen over a wider set of workloads.

Also, even that contrived case should look quite a bit better
with WasActive properly implemented.

> Look at the block, vfs, and mm layers.  Huge pains have been taken to
> batch everything and avoid per-page work -- 20 years of not having
> enough cycles.  And here you throw all this out of the window with
> per-page crossing of the guest/host boundary.

Well, to be fair, those 20 years of effort were because
(1) disk seeks are a million times slower than an in-RAM page
copy and (2) SMP systems were rare and expensive.  The
world changes...


  reply	other threads:[~2012-06-12 16:41 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 20+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2012-06-06 13:07 [RFC 00/10] KVM: Add TMEM host/guest support Sasha Levin
2012-06-06 13:24 ` Avi Kivity
2012-06-08 13:20   ` Sasha Levin
2012-06-08 16:06     ` Dan Magenheimer
2012-06-11 11:17       ` Avi Kivity
2012-06-11  8:09     ` Avi Kivity
2012-06-11 10:26       ` Sasha Levin
2012-06-11 11:45         ` Avi Kivity
2012-06-11 15:44           ` Dan Magenheimer
2012-06-11 17:06             ` Avi Kivity
2012-06-11 19:25               ` Sasha Levin
2012-06-11 19:56                 ` Sasha Levin
2012-06-12 11:46                   ` Avi Kivity
2012-06-12 11:58                     ` Gleb Natapov
2012-06-12 12:01                       ` Avi Kivity
2012-06-12 10:12                 ` Avi Kivity
2012-06-12  1:18               ` Dan Magenheimer
2012-06-12 10:09                 ` Avi Kivity
2012-06-12 16:40                   ` Dan Magenheimer [this message]
2012-06-12 17:54                     ` Avi Kivity

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