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From: "Gupta, Pankaj" <pankaj.gupta@amd.com>
To: "Chenyi Qiang" <chenyi.qiang@intel.com>,
	"David Hildenbrand" <david@redhat.com>,
	"Alexey Kardashevskiy" <aik@amd.com>,
	"Peter Xu" <peterx@redhat.com>,
	"Paolo Bonzini" <pbonzini@redhat.com>,
	"Philippe Mathieu-Daudé" <philmd@linaro.org>,
	"Michael Roth" <michael.roth@amd.com>
Cc: qemu-devel@nongnu.org, kvm@vger.kernel.org,
	Williams Dan J <dan.j.williams@intel.com>,
	Peng Chao P <chao.p.peng@intel.com>,
	Gao Chao <chao.gao@intel.com>, Xu Yilun <yilun.xu@intel.com>,
	Li Xiaoyao <xiaoyao.li@intel.com>
Subject: Re: [PATCH v3 4/7] memory-attribute-manager: Introduce MemoryAttributeManager to manage RAMBLock with guest_memfd
Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2025 09:55:48 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4fd73f58-ac9a-4e24-a2af-98a3cbd6b396@amd.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <9c05e977-119c-481b-82a2-76506c537d97@intel.com>


>>>>>> As the commit 852f0048f3 ("RAMBlock: make guest_memfd require
>>>>>> uncoordinated discard") highlighted, some subsystems like VFIO may
>>>>>> disable ram block discard. However, guest_memfd relies on the discard
>>>>>> operation to perform page conversion between private and shared
>>>>>> memory.
>>>>>> This can lead to stale IOMMU mapping issue when assigning a hardware
>>>>>> device to a confidential VM via shared memory. To address this, it is
>>>>>> crucial to ensure systems like VFIO refresh its IOMMU mappings.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> RamDiscardManager is an existing concept (used by virtio-mem) to
>>>>>> adjust
>>>>>> VFIO mappings in relation to VM page assignment. Effectively page
>>>>>> conversion is similar to hot-removing a page in one mode and adding it
>>>>>> back in the other. Therefore, similar actions are required for page
>>>>>> conversion events. Introduce the RamDiscardManager to guest_memfd to
>>>>>> facilitate this process.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since guest_memfd is not an object, it cannot directly implement the
>>>>>> RamDiscardManager interface. One potential attempt is to implement
>>>>>> it in
>>>>>> HostMemoryBackend. This is not appropriate because guest_memfd is per
>>>>>> RAMBlock. Some RAMBlocks have a memory backend but others do not. In
>>>>>> particular, the ones like virtual BIOS calling
>>>>>> memory_region_init_ram_guest_memfd() do not.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To manage the RAMBlocks with guest_memfd, define a new object named
>>>>>> MemoryAttributeManager to implement the RamDiscardManager
>>>>>> interface. The
>>>>>
>>>>> Isn't this should be the other way around. 'MemoryAttributeManager'
>>>>> should be an interface and RamDiscardManager a type of it, an
>>>>> implementation?
>>>>
>>>> We want to use 'MemoryAttributeManager' to represent RAMBlock to
>>>> implement the RamDiscardManager interface callbacks because RAMBlock is
>>>> not an object. It includes some metadata of guest_memfd like
>>>> shared_bitmap at the same time.
>>>>
>>>> I can't get it that make 'MemoryAttributeManager' an interface and
>>>> RamDiscardManager a type of it. Can you elaborate it a little bit? I
>>>> think at least we need someone to implement the RamDiscardManager
>>>> interface.
>>>
>>> shared <-> private is translated (abstracted) to "populated <->
>>> discarded", which makes sense. The other way around would be wrong.
>>>
>>> It's going to be interesting once we have more logical states, for
>>> example supporting virtio-mem for confidential VMs.
>>>
>>> Then we'd have "shared+populated, private+populated, shared+discard,
>>> private+discarded". Not sure if this could simply be achieved by
>>> allowing multiple RamDiscardManager that are effectively chained, or
>>> if we'd want a different interface.
>>
>> Exactly! In any case generic manager (parent class) would make more
>> sense that can work on different operations/states implemented in child
>> classes (can be chained as well).
> 
> Ah, we are talking about the generic state management. Sorry for my slow
> reaction.
> 
> So we need to
> 1. Define a generic manager Interface, e.g.
> MemoryStateManager/GenericStateManager.
> 2. Make RamDiscardManager the child of MemoryStateManager which manages
> the state of populated and discarded.
> 3. Define a new child manager Interface PrivateSharedManager which
> manages the state of private and shared.
> 4. Define a new object ConfidentialMemoryAttribute to implement the
> PrivateSharedManager interface.
> (Welcome to rename the above Interface/Object)
> 
> Is my understanding correct?

Yes, in that direction. Where 'RamDiscardManager' & 
'PrivateSharedManager' are both child of 'GenericStateManager'.

Depending on listeners registered, corresponding handlers can be called.

Best regards,
Pankaj

  reply	other threads:[~2025-03-19  8:55 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 31+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2025-03-10  8:18 [PATCH v3 0/7] Enable shared device assignment Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-10  8:18 ` [PATCH v3 1/7] memory: Export a helper to get intersection of a MemoryRegionSection with a given range Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-10  8:18 ` [PATCH v3 2/7] memory: Change memory_region_set_ram_discard_manager() to return the result Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-10  8:18 ` [PATCH v3 3/7] memory: Unify the definiton of ReplayRamPopulate() and ReplayRamDiscard() Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-17  3:00   ` Kishen Maloor
2025-03-17  4:11     ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-10  8:18 ` [PATCH v3 4/7] memory-attribute-manager: Introduce MemoryAttributeManager to manage RAMBLock with guest_memfd Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-14 12:11   ` Gupta, Pankaj
2025-03-17  2:54     ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-17 10:36       ` David Hildenbrand
2025-03-17 17:01         ` Gupta, Pankaj
2025-03-18  1:54           ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-19  8:55             ` Gupta, Pankaj [this message]
2025-03-19 11:23               ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-19 11:56                 ` Gupta, Pankaj
2025-03-20  3:15                   ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-24  4:04                     ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-10  8:18 ` [PATCH v3 5/7] memory-attribute-manager: Introduce a callback to notify the shared/private state change Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-10  8:18 ` [PATCH v3 6/7] memory: Attach MemoryAttributeManager to guest_memfd-backed RAMBlocks Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-14  8:21   ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-14  9:00     ` David Hildenbrand
2025-03-14  9:30       ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-14  9:50         ` David Hildenbrand
2025-03-14 10:23           ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-31  8:55             ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-17  6:18   ` Tony Lindgren
2025-03-17  7:32     ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-17  9:45       ` Tony Lindgren
2025-03-17 10:21         ` Chenyi Qiang
2025-03-17 11:07           ` Tony Lindgren
2025-03-10  8:18 ` [PATCH v3 7/7] RAMBlock: Make guest_memfd require coordinate discard Chenyi Qiang

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