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Wed, 18 Jun 2025 06:15:47 +0000 Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2025 14:13:17 +0800 From: Yan Zhao To: Vishal Annapurve CC: "Edgecombe, Rick P" , "kvm@vger.kernel.org" , "quic_eberman@quicinc.com" , "Li, Xiaoyao" , "Shutemov, Kirill" , "Hansen, Dave" , "david@redhat.com" , "thomas.lendacky@amd.com" , "tabba@google.com" , "vbabka@suse.cz" , "Du, Fan" , "michael.roth@amd.com" , "seanjc@google.com" , "Weiny, Ira" , "linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" , "pbonzini@redhat.com" , "ackerleytng@google.com" , "Yamahata, Isaku" , "binbin.wu@linux.intel.com" , "Peng, Chao P" , "Li, Zhiquan1" , "jroedel@suse.de" , "Miao, Jun" , "pgonda@google.com" , "x86@kernel.org" Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH 08/21] KVM: TDX: Increase/decrease folio ref for huge pages Message-ID: Reply-To: Yan Zhao References: <8f686932b23ccdf34888db3dc5a8874666f1f89f.camel@intel.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: X-ClientProxiedBy: KL1PR0401CA0030.apcprd04.prod.outlook.com (2603:1096:820:e::17) To DS7PR11MB5966.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:8:71::6) Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: kvm@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email X-MS-TrafficTypeDiagnostic: DS7PR11MB5966:EE_|SJ5PPFD47FEA206:EE_ X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: d84832d7-3777-483b-a90b-08ddae2f9111 X-LD-Processed: 46c98d88-e344-4ed4-8496-4ed7712e255d,ExtAddr X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck: 1 X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-Relay: 0 X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0;ARA:13230040|1800799024|366016|376014|7416014; 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Here is the correct reference [1]. > > > > > > I'm confused... > > > > > > > > > > > Speculative/transient refcounts came up a few times In the context of > > > > guest_memfd discussions, some examples include: pagetable walkers, > > > > page migration, speculative pagecache lookups, GUP-fast etc. David H > > > > can provide more context here as needed. > > > > > > > > Effectively some core-mm features that are present today or might land > > > > in the future can cause folio refcounts to be grabbed for short > > > > durations without actual access to underlying physical memory. These > > > > scenarios are unlikely to happen for private memory but can't be > > > > discounted completely. > > > > > > This means the refcount could be increased for other reasons, and so guestmemfd > > > shouldn't rely on refcounts for it's purposes? So, it is not a problem for other > > > components handling the page elevate the refcount? > > Besides that, in [3], when kvm_gmem_convert_should_proceed() determines whether > > to convert to private, why is it allowed to just invoke > > kvm_gmem_has_safe_refcount() without taking speculative/transient refcounts into > > account? Isn't it more easier for shared pages to have speculative/transient > > refcounts? > > These speculative refcounts are taken into account, in case of unsafe > refcounts, conversion operation immediately exits to userspace with > EAGAIN and userspace is supposed to retry conversion. Hmm, so why can't private-to-shared conversion also exit to userspace with EAGAIN? In the POC https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/aE%2Fq9VKkmaCcuwpU@yzhao56-desk.sh.intel.com, kvm_gmem_convert_should_proceed() just returns EFAULT (can be modified to EAGAIN) to userspace instead. > > Yes, it's more easier for shared pages to have speculative/transient refcounts. > > > > > [3] https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/d3832fd95a03aad562705872cbda5b3d248ca321.1747264138.git.ackerleytng@google.com/ > > > > > > > > > > Another reason to avoid relying on refcounts is to not block usage of > > > > raw physical memory unmanaged by kernel (without page structs) to back > > > > guest private memory as we had discussed previously. This will help > > > > simplify merge/split operations during conversions and help usecases > > > > like guest memory persistence [2] and non-confidential VMs. > > > > > > If this becomes a thing for private memory (which it isn't yet), then couldn't > > > we just change things at that point? > > > > > > Is the only issue with TDX taking refcounts that it won't work with future code > > > changes? > > > > > > > > > > > [1] https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/diqz7c2lr6wg.fsf@ackerleytng-ctop.c.googlers.com/ > > > > [2] https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/20240805093245.889357-1-jgowans@amazon.com/ > > >