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Thu, 13 Aug 2026 22:29:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.138.10.6] ([185.98.168.14]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 956f58d0204a3-66c79390ae7sm382697d50.20.2026.08.13.22.29.36 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 13 Aug 2026 22:29:37 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2026 01:29:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: [PATCH] crypto: qce - Replace with stub driver To: Eric Biggers Cc: Bartosz Golaszewski , linux-crypto@vger.kernel.org, Herbert Xu , linux-arm-msm@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Kuldeep Singh , Dmitry Baryshkov , Konrad Dybcio , Greg Kroah-Hartman , Krzysztof Kozlowski References: <20260801171242.GA3567@quark> <20260811224110.GC1905@sol> <0d2706c6-79fa-40fc-a24a-6d5ffbf02330@gmail.com> <20260813201019.GA987015@google.com> <20260813213448.GB987015@google.com> Content-Language: en-US From: Demi Marie Obenour Autocrypt: addr=demiobenour@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBFp+A0oBEADffj6anl9/BHhUSxGTICeVl2tob7hPDdhHNgPR4C8xlYt5q49yB+l2nipd aq+4Gk6FZfqC825TKl7eRpUjMriwle4r3R0ydSIGcy4M6eb0IcxmuPYfbWpr/si88QKgyGSV Z7GeNW1UnzTdhYHuFlk8dBSmB1fzhEYEk0RcJqg4AKoq6/3/UorR+FaSuVwT7rqzGrTlscnT DlPWgRzrQ3jssesI7sZLm82E3pJSgaUoCdCOlL7MMPCJwI8JpPlBedRpe9tfVyfu3euTPLPx wcV3L/cfWPGSL4PofBtB8NUU6QwYiQ9Hzx4xOyn67zW73/G0Q2vPPRst8LBDqlxLjbtx/WLR 6h3nBc3eyuZ+q62HS1pJ5EvUT1vjyJ1ySrqtUXWQ4XlZyoEFUfpJxJoN0A9HCxmHGVckzTRl 5FMWo8TCniHynNXsBtDQbabt7aNEOaAJdE7to0AH3T/Bvwzcp0ZJtBk0EM6YeMLtotUut7h2 Bkg1b//r6bTBswMBXVJ5H44Qf0+eKeUg7whSC9qpYOzzrm7+0r9F5u3qF8ZTx55TJc2g656C 9a1P1MYVysLvkLvS4H+crmxA/i08Tc1h+x9RRvqba4lSzZ6/Tmt60DPM5Sc4R0nSm9BBff0N m0bSNRS8InXdO1Aq3362QKX2NOwcL5YaStwODNyZUqF7izjK4QARAQABzTxEZW1pIE1hcmll IE9iZW5vdXIgKGxvdmVyIG9mIGNvZGluZykgPGRlbWlvYmVub3VyQGdtYWlsLmNvbT7CwXgE EwECACIFAlp+A0oCGwMGCwkIBwMCBhUIAgkKCwQWAgMBAh4BAheAAAoJELKItV//nCLBhr8Q AK/xrb4wyi71xII2hkFBpT59ObLN+32FQT7R3lbZRjVFjc6yMUjOb1H/hJVxx+yo5gsSj5LS 9AwggioUSrcUKldfA/PKKai2mzTlUDxTcF3vKx6iMXKA6AqwAw4B57ZEJoMM6egm57TV19kz PMc879NV2nc6+elaKl+/kbVeD3qvBuEwsTe2Do3HAAdrfUG/j9erwIk6gha/Hp9yZlCnPTX+ VK+xifQqt8RtMqS5R/S8z0msJMI/ajNU03kFjOpqrYziv6OZLJ5cuKb3bZU5aoaRQRDzkFIR 6aqtFLTohTo20QywXwRa39uFaOT/0YMpNyel0kdOszFOykTEGI2u+kja35g9TkH90kkBTG+a EWttIht0Hy6YFmwjcAxisSakBuHnHuMSOiyRQLu43ej2+mDWgItLZ48Mu0C3IG1seeQDjEYP tqvyZ6bGkf2Vj+L6wLoLLIhRZxQOedqArIk/Sb2SzQYuxN44IDRt+3ZcDqsPppoKcxSyd1Ny 2tpvjYJXlfKmOYLhTWs8nwlAlSHX/c/jz/ywwf7eSvGknToo1Y0VpRtoxMaKW1nvH0OeCSVJ itfRP7YbiRVc2aNqWPCSgtqHAuVraBRbAFLKh9d2rKFB3BmynTUpc1BQLJP8+D5oNyb8Ts4x Xd3iV/uD8JLGJfYZIR7oGWFLP4uZ3tkneDfYzsFNBFp+A0oBEAC9ynZI9LU+uJkMeEJeJyQ/ 8VFkCJQPQZEsIGzOTlPnwvVna0AS86n2Z+rK7R/usYs5iJCZ55/JISWd8xD57ue0eB47bcJv VqGlObI2DEG8TwaW0O0duRhDgzMEL4t1KdRAepIESBEA/iPpI4gfUbVEIEQuqdqQyO4GAe+M kD0Hy5JH/0qgFmbaSegNTdQg5iqYjRZ3ttiswalql1/iSyv1WYeC1OAs+2BLOAT2NEggSiVO txEfgewsQtCWi8H1SoirakIfo45Hz0tk/Ad9ZWh2PvOGt97Ka85o4TLJxgJJqGEnqcFUZnJJ riwoaRIS8N2C8/nEM53jb1sH0gYddMU3QxY7dYNLIUrRKQeNkF30dK7V6JRH7pleRlf+wQcN fRAIUrNlatj9TxwivQrKnC9aIFFHEy/0mAgtrQShcMRmMgVlRoOA5B8RTulRLCmkafvwuhs6 dCxN0GNAORIVVFxjx9Vn7OqYPgwiofZ6SbEl0hgPyWBQvE85klFLZLoj7p+joDY1XNQztmfA rnJ9x+YV4igjWImINAZSlmEcYtd+xy3Li/8oeYDAqrsnrOjb+WvGhCykJk4urBog2LNtcyCj kTs7F+WeXGUo0NDhbd3Z6AyFfqeF7uJ3D5hlpX2nI9no/ugPrrTVoVZAgrrnNz0iZG2DVx46 x913pVKHl5mlYQARAQABwsFfBBgBAgAJBQJafgNKAhsMAAoJELKItV//nCLBwNIP/AiIHE8b oIqReFQyaMzxq6lE4YZCZNj65B/nkDOvodSiwfwjjVVE2V3iEzxMHbgyTCGA67+Bo/d5aQGj gn0TPtsGzelyQHipaUzEyrsceUGWYoKXYyVWKEfyh0cDfnd9diAm3VeNqchtcMpoehETH8fr RHnJdBcjf112PzQSdKC6kqU0Q196c4Vp5HDOQfNiDnTf7gZSj0BraHOByy9LEDCLhQiCmr+2 E0rW4tBtDAn2HkT9uf32ZGqJCn1O+2uVfFhGu6vPE5qkqrbSE8TG+03H8ecU2q50zgHWPdHM OBvy3EhzfAh2VmOSTcRK+tSUe/u3wdLRDPwv/DTzGI36Kgky9MsDC5gpIwNbOJP2G/q1wT1o Gkw4IXfWv2ufWiXqJ+k7HEi2N1sree7Dy9KBCqb+ca1vFhYPDJfhP75I/VnzHVssZ/rYZ9+5 1yDoUABoNdJNSGUYl+Yh9Pw9pE3Kt4EFzUlFZWbE4xKL/NPno+z4J9aWemLLszcYz/u3XnbO vUSQHSrmfOzX3cV4yfmjM5lewgSstoxGyTx2M8enslgdXhPthZlDnTnOT+C+OTsh8+m5tos8 HQjaPM01MKBiAqdPgksm1wu2DrrwUi6ChRVTUBcj6+/9IJ81H2P2gJk3Ls3AVIxIffLoY34E +MYSfkEjBz0E8CLOcAw7JIwAaeBT In-Reply-To: <20260813213448.GB987015@google.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------nXzoSzcLz1089Ey4q1hbHcJh" X-CRM114-Version: 20100106-BlameMichelson ( TRE 0.9.0 (BSD) ) MR-646709E3 X-CRM114-CacheID: sfid-20260813_222941_500988_E5A60F7C X-CRM114-Status: GOOD ( 24.99 ) X-BeenThere: linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.34 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: "linux-arm-kernel" Errors-To: linux-arm-kernel-bounces+linux-arm-kernel=archiver.kernel.org@lists.infradead.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --------------nXzoSzcLz1089Ey4q1hbHcJh Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------b2lmVs5wJKpQS07vcN45h9uV"; protected-headers="v1"; hp="clear" Message-ID: Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2026 01:29:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: [PATCH] crypto: qce - Replace with stub driver To: Eric Biggers Cc: Bartosz Golaszewski , linux-crypto@vger.kernel.org, Herbert Xu , linux-arm-msm@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Kuldeep Singh , Dmitry Baryshkov , Konrad Dybcio , Greg Kroah-Hartman , Krzysztof Kozlowski References: <20260801171242.GA3567@quark> <20260811224110.GC1905@sol> <0d2706c6-79fa-40fc-a24a-6d5ffbf02330@gmail.com> <20260813201019.GA987015@google.com> <20260813213448.GB987015@google.com> Content-Language: en-US From: Demi Marie Obenour Autocrypt: addr=demiobenour@gmail.com; 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charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 8/13/26 17:34, Eric Biggers wrote: > On Thu, Aug 13, 2026 at 05:00:28PM -0400, Demi Marie Obenour wrote: >> On 8/13/26 16:10, Eric Biggers wrote: >>> On Thu, Aug 13, 2026 at 03:09:36PM -0400, Demi Marie Obenour wrote: >>>>> SM8650 with the QCE is FIPS 140-2 certified and apparently this mak= es >>>>> a difference. Don't ask me if that makes sense, I don't claim to un= derstand >>>>> the legal aspects of it. >>>> >>>> That sounds like the kind of thing that would cause someone to use >>>> a worse implementation of cryptographic algorithms =F0=9F=99=82. >>>> >>>> For what it is worth, many common uses of kernel cryptography can't >>>> use the QCE. This notably applies to the CSPRNG (/dev/urandom etc),= >>>> storage encryption, and AF_ALG. Therefore, I expect that anyone who= >>>> needs FIPS 140 compliance with Linux needs to ensure that the softwa= re >>>> crypto is certified, as that's what actually gets used in most cases= =2E >>> >>> Well there's that, and also the Inline Crypto Engine (which is actual= ly >>> being used and is unrelated to QCE) has its own FIPS certification. >>> >>> Which upstream kernel feature, if any, is QCE being used with? I hav= e >>> asked this multiple times and still not gotten an answer. >> Historically AF_ALG has been used to access FIPS-certified crypto >> from userspace, but that no longer can be used with QCE. Most kernel >> features reject CRYPTO_ALG_ASYNC, CRYPTO_ALG_ALLOCATES_MEMORY, or both= =2E >> If I exclude tests and fallback paths of other drivers, that leaves >> crypto/asymmetric_keys/public_key.c (hashing), BPF, MACsec, OpenVPN >> data channel offload, ecryptfs, Ceph, SMB, IPsec, mac802154, TIPC, TLS= , >> and crypto/kpp.c. AF_ALG only allows offload drivers for cbc(paes), >> which QCE doesn't implement. QCE is broken with IPsec and probably >> some other networking protocols, as it would wind up taking a mutex >> in softirq context. >=20 > It's a far more narrow list than even that. asymmetric_keys uses the > shash API, so it cannot use QCE. BPF crypto uses the lskcipher API, so= > it cannot use QCE. MACsec uses AES-GCM which QCE driver doesn't have. > OpenVPN uses AES-GCM or ChaCha20Poly1305, neither of which the QCE > driver has. The non-legacy Ceph protocol uses AES-GCM, which again the= > QCE driver doesn't have. IPsec does decryption in softirq context, > which the QCE driver doesn't support. QCE driver does not implement kp= p > algorithms. SMB, TIPC, TLS, all usually use AES-GCM as well. Until > just a couple months ago ksmbd crashed if passed an async algorithm, > which proves it was never used with QCE. There is really not much left= , > maybe ecryptfs AES-CBC file contents encryption? But even for that the= > cra_priority makes it not actually used. >=20 > But we are going into the weeds here with trying to theorize some way > the code could theoretically be reached. It seems it's really just not= =2E > Or at least if there is a use it is not upstream and/or is not actually= > the appropriate code to be using. At this point I think it is quite clear that the following algorithms provided by QCE are unusable no matter what userspace does: - SHA256 - HMAC-SHA256 - AES-XTS - authenc(hmac(sha256),cbc(aes)) Those should all be deleted as unreachable or unused code. There are also a lot of algorithms in other drivers that can also be removed. If the driver was actually used, I _suspect_ it was by requesting it explicitly via AF_ALG. AF_ALG won't let you do that anymore, though. The other possibilities I can think of are messing with priorities via NETLINK_CRYPTO or somehow not building any software implementations with a higher cra_priority than QCE. Splitting the driver up would be much better than the current status quo, though. --=20 Sincerely, Demi Marie Obenour (she/her/hers) --------------b2lmVs5wJKpQS07vcN45h9uV-- --------------nXzoSzcLz1089Ey4q1hbHcJh Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="OpenPGP_signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="OpenPGP_signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEEopQtqVJW1aeuo9/sszaHOrMp8lMFAmp+p7kACgkQszaHOrMp 8lO4Ng/+Oat+SL0D3pc+KRTBhovFWMYo6JusJNlUNDqAl2X6LlQuI0BtFeOQ2R0B Ei4KHe0R3Nv2ucbV52uzM+DaP/CpDPJVCcPZlkjegIQ6om1L1UvBWdJNrN5hdBzk pmHyWBlZjO+1risApvLyvsfbAJu4UP5iKJ/A2GQ8/86ILNoNuf4XjkftTer156VV WLRWkLo70FC+y5aqXZis3ca+dRHdwMp9oea45eBe0AAPt69KF5EH/CcoOyjQYYr7 CuhyY03LixxHB/Tp6FiZJpUH/OQhIoZQJSueH4Hp7/sbW5OSZRFKywggi5+IrCOP HHngA4qycTGcOb/2RIWiDud2ssUWfzCLWoz2fkxkBhzFOTtUAfjBhp7lKRevRFJ2 gNgyuYhrC2Vv0j6d+d0ZRNRKNsLavVw0R2GJtHh10Bn3OMwMOvDexjvT+jrK4y3y Xgof6cBhyhLCdPU2/jmWhzmITCdo3QzAGisJok1TgcgblmpiVmnWz9w3f1eAPGDS eS4CjEb2I9XLs+7vj6Avj7c26QiWXYMICNwJA7SfWhRi3PrFQXizN5ZfeVH4HcDW ym7OdWDBbNeiRdrv4VHpsCYb9ELq5jBkHaBf3G1kbWdM++rlSPI7yFtzmCckwAZR GIRPq8iTu4vMSfSvs0mt8yMxLJxfebIO+c+Oles0wKwfNt/IyCw= =69KI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------nXzoSzcLz1089Ey4q1hbHcJh--