From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from smtp.kernel.org (aws-us-west-2-korg-mail-1.web.codeaurora.org [10.30.226.201]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8E5A63594F; Tue, 12 Aug 2025 20:30:46 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=10.30.226.201 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1755030646; cv=none; b=CHsQQZE960tEfywrZ/y97hgIBoZqiCWEweuWBaXIFsPbb1pJYWiwvZdBPRYpioziXcwNkrVkMQgHFETRCdPukqK0NqXN+WBETODz2hk5LObu9ECMbxQ22G3XbBRJORfv415igVD7VCnZr9EeSvDqx952FnsSokq5uUHgLJWvqTg= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1755030646; c=relaxed/simple; bh=C7Zan8R4dIjGaXNNFSK51VuqKxXjZm7KmeThegus+1U=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:References:MIME-Version: Content-Type:Content-Disposition:In-Reply-To; b=p7ueO4RIuNLSQZqxJCCcWSFKCaIb31USr7df+j/ZltJbfQPe3/2EPv1iwHC4gdGXsRMpIKUXfXsKkHy+JkV6j3t6esbRucodri/GKhtM1NBJ4+YdTds2GnL4RcRlhE4h5B5Qo0p/ZJgPnedqr/J56NEuf8PZ+/l6zZ3OrsuIoz8= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=kernel.org header.i=@kernel.org header.b=nTynvEuJ; arc=none smtp.client-ip=10.30.226.201 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=kernel.org header.i=@kernel.org header.b="nTynvEuJ" Received: by smtp.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B773BC4CEF0; Tue, 12 Aug 2025 20:30:45 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=kernel.org; s=k20201202; t=1755030646; bh=C7Zan8R4dIjGaXNNFSK51VuqKxXjZm7KmeThegus+1U=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=nTynvEuJXJyCB1WIqYH8bG0noAxAVgb4QN8892IG2eok5kjGnVY0G6ZzGoWOu6I/+ t+agr9V2069mX3wpn0D/zzWXKciOp6lUufeRMWDCzeSenXuetZd3JjQwgvOtHD7t7U dazn2XDTdttFTAAvQJ/lKhBC+BFkhxhByjfYUSH92txYTCLD4nkri1RYYH7qHKM+/t VGsb6BjltmEOPfd7NuQJKJGrWsaWAN0qMZWdqMkRZdP2X0whbmYipMc13dCpAMQsPI VYG/kv+a+4V4ulzZOQM38e2CzMcKtc4nntGw6ykOQVBOcHKQ7FeXavMSSo7G1e+8Gm /7rOGmgDthKAA== Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2025 14:30:44 -0600 From: Keith Busch To: Kent Overstreet Cc: Konstantin Shelekhin , admin@aquinas.su, linux-bcachefs@vger.kernel.org, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, list-bcachefs@carlthompson.net, malte.schroeder@tnxip.de, torvalds@linux-foundation.org Subject: Re: [GIT PULL] bcachefs changes for 6.17 Message-ID: References: <3ik3h6hfm4v2y3rtpjshk5y4wlm5n366overw2lp72qk5izizw@k6vxp22uwnwa> <55e623db-ff03-4d33-98d1-1042106e83c6@ftml.net> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-bcachefs@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: On Tue, Aug 12, 2025 at 04:03:17PM -0400, Kent Overstreet wrote: > On Tue, Aug 12, 2025 at 01:35:56PM -0600, Keith Busch wrote: > > On Mon, Aug 11, 2025 at 10:26:03AM -0400, Kent Overstreet wrote: > > > On the other hand, for the only incidences I can remotely refer to in > > > the past year and a half, there has been: > > ... > > > > > - the block layer developer who went on a four email rant where he, > > > charitably, misread the spec or the patchset or both; all this over a > > > patch to simply bring a warning in line with the actual NVME and SCSI > > > specs. > > > > Are you talking about this thread? > > > > https://lore.kernel.org/linux-block/20250311201518.3573009-14-kent.overstreet@linux.dev/ > > > > I try to closely follow those lists, and that's the only thread I recall > > that even slightly rings a bell from your description, however it's not > > an accurate description (you were the one who misread the specs there; I > > tried to help bridge the gap). I recall the interaction was pretty tame > > though, so maybe you're talking about something else. Perhaps a link for > > context if I got it wrong? > > I've since seen a lot of actual test data from SCSI hard drives - fua > reads are definitely not cached, without exception across manufacturers. > > On NVME the situation is much murkier. Okay, I take it I got the right thread then. I just wanted to get the context. For the record, all the specs align with what read fua does (anyone interested can visit the linked thread, I don't want to hijack this one for it).