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Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.6.0 Subject: Re: [External] [LSF/MM/BPF BoF] Session for Zoned Storage 2023 Content-Language: en-US To: "Viacheslav A.Dubeyko" , =?UTF-8?Q?Javier_Gonz=c3=a1lez?= Cc: Viacheslav Dubeyko , Luis Chamberlain , Linux FS Devel , linux-block@vger.kernel.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Matias_Bj=c3=b8rling?= , Bart Van Assche , Adam Manzanares , Hans Holmberg , lsf-pc@lists.linux-foundation.org References: <4CC4F55E-17B3-47E2-A8C5-9098CCEB65D6@dubeyko.com> <5DF10459-88F3-48DA-AEB2-5B436549A194@bytedance.com> <20230109153315.waqfokse4srv6xlz@mpHalley-2.localdomain> From: Damien Le Moal Organization: Western Digital Research In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-block@vger.kernel.org On 1/10/23 04:11, Viacheslav A.Dubeyko wrote: >=20 >> On Jan 9, 2023, at 7:33 AM, Javier Gonz=C3=A1lez wrote: >> >=20 > >=20 >>>> >>>> (1) I am going to share SSDFS patchset soon. And topic is: >>>> SSDFS + ZNS SSD: deterministic architecture decreasing TCO cost of d= ata infrastructure. >> >> >> Would be good to see the patches before LSF/MM/BPF. >> >=20 > I am making code cleanup now. I am expecting to share patches in two we= eks. >=20 >> I saw your talk at Plumbers. Do you think you have more data to share >> too? Maybe even a comparisson with btrfs in terms of WAF and Space Amp= ? >> >=20 > I am working to share more data. So, I should have more details. > I have data for btrfs already. Do you mean that you would like to see c= omparison > btrfs + compression vs. ssdfs? By the way, I am using my own methodolog= y > to estimate WAF and space amplification. What methodology do you have i= n mind? > Maybe, I could improve mine. :) >=20 > >=20 >>>> >>> >>> I think we can consider such discussions: >>> (1) I assume that we still need to discuss PO2 zone sizes? >> >> For this discussion to move forward, we need users rather than vendors >> talking about the need. If someone is willing to drive this discussion= , >> then it makes sense. I do not believe we will make progress otherwise. >> >=20 > As part of ByteDance, I am on user side now. :) So, let me have some in= ternal > discussion and to summarize vision(s) on our side. I believe that, mayb= e, it makes > sense to summarize a list of pros and cons and to have something like a= nalysis or > brainstorming here. >=20 > >=20 >> >>> (4) New ZNS standard features that we need to support on block layer = + FS levels? >> >> Do you have any concrete examples in mind? >> >=20 > My point here that we could summarize: > (1) what features already implemented and supported, > (2) what features are under implementation and what is progress, > (3) what features need to be implemented yet. >=20 > Have we implemented everything already? :) Standards are full of features that are not useful in a general purpose system. So we likely never will implement everything. We never did for SCSI and ATA and never will either. >=20 >>> (5) ZNS drive emulation + additional testing features? >> >> Is this QEMU alone or do you have other ideas in mind? >> >=20 > My point is the same here. Let=E2=80=99s summarize how reasonably good = is emulation now. > Do we need to support the emulation of any additional features? > And we can talk not only about QEMU. >=20 > Thanks, > Slava. > =20 --=20 Damien Le Moal Western Digital Research