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From: Thomas Bellman <bellman@nsc.liu.se>
To: Olaf van der Spek <olafvdspek@gmail.com>
Cc: Massimo Maggi <massimo@mmmm.it>,
	linux-btrfs <linux-btrfs@vger.kernel.org>
Subject: Re: Atomic file data replace API
Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2011 22:43:03 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4D28DA67.6060404@nsc.liu.se> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin4BTH-1CfNtEt8CTspGJ9vJ_9mokP4hBM7c0Dw@mail.gmail.com>

Olaf van der Spek wrote:

> On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 8:29 PM, Thomas Bellman <bellman@nsc.liu.se> wrote:
>> What is the visibility of the changes for other processes supposed
>> to be in the meantime?  I.e., if things happen in this order:
> 
> Should be atomic too, at close time.
> 
>> 1. Process A does fda = open("foo.txt", O_TRUNC|O_ATOMIC)
>> 2. Process B does fdb = open("foo.txt", O_RDONLY)
>> 3. B does read(fdb, buf, 4096)
>> 4. A does write(fda, "NEW DATA\n", 9)
>> 5. Process C comes in and does fdc = open("foo.txt", O_RDONLY)
>> 6. C does read(fdc, buf, 4096)
>> 7. A calls close(fda)
>>
>> Does B see an empty file, or does it see the old contents of
>> the file?
> 
> Old file, otherwise A wouldn't be atomic.
> 
>> Does C see "NEW DATA\n", or does it see the old
>> contents of the file, or perhaps an empty file?
> 
> Old file again, as the 'transaction' isn't finished until close.

So, basically database transactions with an isolation level of
"committed read", for file operations.  That's something I have
wanted for a long time, especially if I also get a rollback()
operation, but have never heard of any Unix that implemented it.

A separate commit() operation would be better than conflating it
with close().  And as I said, we want a rollback() as well.  And
a process that terminates without committing the transaction that
it is performing, should have the transaction automatically rolled
back.

I only have a very shallow knowledge about the internals of the
Linux kernel in regards to filesystems, but I suspect that this
could be implemented almost entirely within the VFS, and not need
to touch the actual filesystems, as long as you are satisfied
with a limited amount of transaction space (what fits in RAM +
swap).

I'm looking forward to your implementation. :-)  Even though I
suspect that it would be a rather large undertaking to implement...


	/Bellman

  reply	other threads:[~2011-01-08 21:43 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 28+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2011-01-06 20:01 Atomic file data replace API Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-07 13:55 ` Mike Fleetwood
2011-01-07 14:01   ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-07 14:10     ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-07 14:58 ` Chris Mason
2011-01-07 15:01   ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-07 15:05     ` Chris Mason
2011-01-07 15:08       ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-07 15:13         ` Chris Mason
2011-01-07 15:17           ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-07 16:12             ` Chris Mason
2011-01-07 16:19               ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-07 16:26               ` Hubert Kario
2011-01-07 19:29                 ` Chris Mason
2011-01-08 14:40                   ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-26 18:30                     ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-26 19:30                       ` Chris Mason
2011-01-26 21:56                         ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-07 16:32             ` Massimo Maggi
2011-01-07 16:34               ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-07 19:29                 ` Thomas Bellman
2011-01-08 14:36                   ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-08 21:43                     ` Thomas Bellman [this message]
2011-01-09 15:16                       ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-09 18:56                         ` Thomas Bellman
2011-01-09 19:06                           ` Olaf van der Spek
2011-01-09 20:13                           ` Phillip Susi
2011-01-08  1:11   ` Phillip Susi

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