From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.1 (2015-04-28) on archive.lwn.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.8 required=5.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.1 Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [209.132.180.67]) by archive.lwn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FDE67D072 for ; Fri, 18 May 2018 17:02:12 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S1752455AbeERRBy (ORCPT ); Fri, 18 May 2018 13:01:54 -0400 Received: from mx3-rdu2.redhat.com ([66.187.233.73]:39104 "EHLO mx1.redhat.com" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-FAIL) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S1752296AbeERRBu (ORCPT ); Fri, 18 May 2018 13:01:50 -0400 Received: from smtp.corp.redhat.com (int-mx04.intmail.prod.int.rdu2.redhat.com [10.11.54.4]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.redhat.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E798240200A9; Fri, 18 May 2018 17:01:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: from redhat.com (ovpn-125-92.rdu2.redhat.com [10.10.125.92]) by smtp.corp.redhat.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 57F4E2026E03; Fri, 18 May 2018 17:01:49 +0000 (UTC) Date: Fri, 18 May 2018 20:01:49 +0300 From: "Michael S. Tsirkin" To: Eduardo Habkost Cc: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Paolo Bonzini , Radim =?utf-8?B?S3LEjW3DocWZ?= , Jonathan Corbet , Thomas Gleixner , Ingo Molnar , "H. Peter Anvin" , x86@kernel.org, kvm@vger.kernel.org, linux-doc@vger.kernel.org, qemu-devel@nongnu.org Subject: Re: [PATCH] kvm: rename HINTS_DEDICATED to KVM_HINTS_REALTIME Message-ID: <20180518195139-mutt-send-email-mst@kernel.org> References: <1526568841-35372-1-git-send-email-mst@redhat.com> <20180517184658.GA1543@localhost.localdomain> <20180517225316-mutt-send-email-mst@kernel.org> <20180518160431.GX25013@localhost.localdomain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20180518160431.GX25013@localhost.localdomain> X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.78 on 10.11.54.4 X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.5.16 (mx1.redhat.com [10.11.55.6]); Fri, 18 May 2018 17:01:50 +0000 (UTC) X-Greylist: inspected by milter-greylist-4.5.16 (mx1.redhat.com [10.11.55.6]); Fri, 18 May 2018 17:01:50 +0000 (UTC) for IP:'10.11.54.4' DOMAIN:'int-mx04.intmail.prod.int.rdu2.redhat.com' HELO:'smtp.corp.redhat.com' FROM:'mst@redhat.com' RCPT:'' Sender: linux-doc-owner@vger.kernel.org Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-doc@vger.kernel.org On Fri, May 18, 2018 at 01:04:31PM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > CCing qemu-devel, as I'm now discussing userspace. > > On Thu, May 17, 2018 at 10:55:33PM +0300, Michael S. Tsirkin wrote: > > On Thu, May 17, 2018 at 03:46:58PM -0300, Eduardo Habkost wrote: > > > On Thu, May 17, 2018 at 05:54:24PM +0300, Michael S. Tsirkin wrote: > > > > HINTS_DEDICATED seems to be somewhat confusing: > > > > > > > > Guest doesn't really care whether it's the only task running on a host > > > > CPU as long as it's not preempted. > > > > > > > > And there are more reasons for Guest to be preempted than host CPU > > > > sharing, for example, with memory overcommit it can get preempted on a > > > > memory access, post copy migration can cause preemption, etc. > > > > > > > > Let's call it KVM_HINTS_REALTIME which seems to better > > > > match what guests expect. > > > > > > > > Also, the flag most be set on all vCPUs - current guests assume th. > > > > Note so in the documentation. > > > > > > > > Signed-off-by: Michael S. Tsirkin > > > > --- > > > > Documentation/virtual/kvm/cpuid.txt | 6 +++--- > > > > arch/x86/include/uapi/asm/kvm_para.h | 2 +- > > > > arch/x86/kernel/kvm.c | 8 ++++---- > > > > 3 files changed, 8 insertions(+), 8 deletions(-) > > > > > > > > diff --git a/Documentation/virtual/kvm/cpuid.txt b/Documentation/virtual/kvm/cpuid.txt > > > > index d4f33eb8..ab022dc 100644 > > > > --- a/Documentation/virtual/kvm/cpuid.txt > > > > +++ b/Documentation/virtual/kvm/cpuid.txt > > > > @@ -72,8 +72,8 @@ KVM_FEATURE_CLOCKSOURCE_STABLE_BIT || 24 || host will warn if no guest-side > > > > > > > > flag || value || meaning > > > > ================================================================================== > > > > -KVM_HINTS_DEDICATED || 0 || guest checks this feature bit to > > > > - || || determine if there is vCPU pinning > > > > - || || and there is no vCPU over-commitment, > > > > +KVM_HINTS_REALTIME || 0 || guest checks this feature bit to > > > > + || || determine that vCPUs are never > > > > + || || preempted for an unlimited time, > > > > || || allowing optimizations > > > > > > My understanding of the original patch is that the intention is > > > to tell the guest that it is very unlikely to be preempted, > > > so it > > > can choose a more appropriate spinlock implementation. This > > > description implies that the guest will never be preempted, which > > > is much stronger guarantee. > > > > Note: > > > > ... for an unlimited time. > > Which still sounds like a stronger guarantee than the original > description. But: > > > > > > > > > Isn't this new description incompatible with existing usage of > > > the hint, which might include people who just use vCPU pinning > > > but no mlock? > > > > Without mlock you should always use pv spinlocks. > > > > Otherwise you risk blocking on a lock taken by > > a VCPU that is in turn blocked on IO, where the IO > > is not completing because CPU is being used up > > spinning. > > So the stronger guarantee seems necessary. > > Now what should host userspace do if the user is trying to run an > existing configuration where the CPUID hint was set but memory is > not pinned? > > -- > Eduardo As much as we'd like to be helpful and validate input, you need a real time host too. I'm not sure how we'd find out - I suggest we do not bother for now. -- MST -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-doc" in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html