From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from smtp.kernel.org (aws-us-west-2-korg-mail-1.web.codeaurora.org [10.30.226.201]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DB6EA45005; Fri, 27 Dec 2024 18:31:35 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=10.30.226.201 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1735324296; cv=none; b=KJ+tB73XJj6k8tN03XZBSz1zmF0Ofs1p327+PD02jj8+MXeQSwvZ/5pGuxF44EPM7OA4L6kmz9YEm20StUhUsvd+9WR2m0f59+2a8ikwcav23SKCVmXSUtPAFg6UpowXkaW/9PnozN5E+bLH3NQ/ZlAjMZhzB6C5w+YPuD1b3gE= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1735324296; c=relaxed/simple; bh=utigrWpY3Dvby5cQbgGg+unB6OhBi5DsrEDYQJ+Hocc=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=Pfwy5icmt3c664cqX9kwlddbyv4pj6miCXwO1L3/3iHna4iXnl4T07ik3c5vqvC/BYaCoWeXG1h5bLz0o5PIeUGQUxAOT/EvFiQvyWvxSyfm2eP02h2n7E9mXRdvAXV7BPwOkIdmGBILNCi2hEuOmRl1Ntp7bFOCQDWwn+wa4+4= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=kernel.org header.i=@kernel.org header.b=R8cXIzIw; arc=none smtp.client-ip=10.30.226.201 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=kernel.org header.i=@kernel.org header.b="R8cXIzIw" Received: by smtp.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D786EC4CED0; Fri, 27 Dec 2024 18:31:34 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=kernel.org; s=k20201202; t=1735324295; bh=utigrWpY3Dvby5cQbgGg+unB6OhBi5DsrEDYQJ+Hocc=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=R8cXIzIw2NLYknuXZ2nWH1duHIe8BRAabKI1O3qK5OI3S9J2HrA8U5nKLn7caVC9v wNSb22FUanVuRa9rLwA6yJ9UsC3PKW4tPX64ZDxnZkeF/w6QkcvL86QGRSAoFiTy1O DNVoUwIO67s5UNXxMPJXeGXbRwrW/ZaKpl4uYlWVul/M76qGOMd3rwr8kIfdhSFmDG Z3N/wy1fskE4yETYR3m6BItozyPWjKTdMxyoU3ShkzEs/g3DR7rCiG4cjqnVhHyPgb CYknHXtMoTuaKeXWRxIzRqhUvq6/Ovi7F/BQ3Itbq5YG7SXGeSjFj8W97X1gf8pZZm ASlO8kKthwkow== Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2024 10:31:34 -0800 From: Jakub Kicinski To: Gur Stavi Cc: , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , Subject: Re: [PATCH net-next v01 1/1] hinic3: module initialization and tx/rx logic Message-ID: <20241227103134.21168df3@kernel.org> In-Reply-To: <20241225125649.2595970-1-gur.stavi@huawei.com> References: <20241223073955.52da7539@kernel.org> <20241225125649.2595970-1-gur.stavi@huawei.com> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-doc@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Wed, 25 Dec 2024 14:56:49 +0200 Gur Stavi wrote: > > I understand. But I'm concerned about the self-assured tone of the > > "it's not supported" message, that's very corporate verbiage. Annotating > > endian is standard practice of writing upstream drivers. It makes me > > doubt if you have any developers with upstream experience on your team > > if you don't know that. That and the fact that Huawei usually tops > > the list of net-negative review contributors in netdev. > > The most popular combination in the last 3 decades was little endian > CPUs with big endian device interfaces. Endianity conversion was a > necessity and therefore endian annotation became standard practice. > But it was never symmetric, conversion to/from BE was more common than > conversion to/from LE. > > As the pendulum moved from horizontal market to vertical market and major > companies started to develop both hw and sw, the hw engineers transformed > proprietary parts of the interface to little endian to save extra work in > the sw. AWS did it. Azure did it. Huawei did it. These vertical companies > do not care about endianity of CPUs they do not use. > This is not "corporate verbiage" this is a real market shift. Don't misquote me. You did it in your previous reply, now you're doing it again. If you don't understand what I'm saying you can ask for clarifications. > The necessity for endian conversion is gone (or just halved). Will the > standard practice remain? There is not a single __le annotation in Amazon > and Microsoft code. Not in Mellanox code either. Maybe their hw is fully > BE (have to wonder about their DPUs). Amazingly, Intel that only creates > little endian CPUs has lots of __le annotations. But they are the flag > barer of horizontal market. > > Interesting how both Amazon and Microsoft started with: > depends on X86 > Thus evaded demand for adding __le annotations to the code. > Later, both sneaked in quiet small patches with replacement to: > depends on !CPU_BIG_ENDIAN > Maybe that is the true meaning of "upstream experience".