From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from perceval.ideasonboard.com (perceval.ideasonboard.com [213.167.242.64]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0C5772E06E4; Tue, 13 Oct 2026 13:01:47 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=213.167.242.64 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1791896509; cv=none; b=EctUjEdeIA9yxphkWJGtwzqYbxkNo9jeeDtX/OsKTgJFhbxXSwx38vTRb3tChx/LG/6dYEkwOk806GqO6It8xX6GLh8y4F7AepE7bH0NsgndJP5xbZcxjUh2AXbS5lkBcVkpJVfk8voZLEYLXq4uqA6RVXqACJdW2elHM6dRb98= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1791896509; c=relaxed/simple; bh=Q/jYL8BfCc2XZBjNa/XDCDhEq8sNzI4qwahH4HimM54=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:References:MIME-Version: Content-Type:Content-Disposition:In-Reply-To; b=HnlBoFCBDE/O1J6pLg6H8V+nU6E3mPLi8spZe6AKHEWuf21ZzgTpdtl2fhs3tcDSxljb+UNRya3hIbj6q4dVcRBT26dlJtnEjc3EIBt1xGs0k+0R8JPLBMjQLwU3trQFiupk0JUOMgf6P20Ds8oZvolCU5zcJ4M287G35EuZlPI= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=ideasonboard.com; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=ideasonboard.com; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ideasonboard.com header.i=@ideasonboard.com header.b=abpf6wUz; arc=none smtp.client-ip=213.167.242.64 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=ideasonboard.com Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=ideasonboard.com Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ideasonboard.com header.i=@ideasonboard.com header.b="abpf6wUz" Received: from killaraus.ideasonboard.com (unknown [185.104.138.147]) by perceval.ideasonboard.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 88F271E4; Tue, 13 Oct 2026 14:59:43 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=ideasonboard.com; s=mail; t=1791896384; bh=Q/jYL8BfCc2XZBjNa/XDCDhEq8sNzI4qwahH4HimM54=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=abpf6wUzqQRqFcalJJS6I0Qju+lIW63B/WfA6tWuYk+OVOxGvQ7XHg+BLRdT6l6VH YAEnySapCd9kQw6kLZ62vTFN2EF57wGEBUO+Ap+S3GIkNut2Geve0HP0N60+/UZwax LyCx0+TfKCYNZ+Zbw8oFKmJstCSsdx6gU4juli1I= Date: Tue, 13 Oct 2026 15:01:34 +0200 From: Laurent Pinchart To: Jori Koolstra Cc: "Lorenzo Stoakes (ARM)" , Linus Torvalds , Sasha Levin , Greg Kroah-Hartman , corbet@lwn.net, skhan@linuxfoundation.org, rdunlap@infradead.org, federico.vaga@vaga.pv.it, apw@canonical.com, joe@perches.com, workflows@vger.kernel.org, linux-doc@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, Krzysztof Kozlowski , Justin Stitt , Carlos Maiolino , Jakub Kicinski , Brian Foster , Christoph Hellwig , David Disseldorp , Mark Brown , Jani Nikula , Jens Axboe , "David Hildenbrand (Arm)" , Vlastimil Babka , "Christian Brauner (Amutable)" Subject: Re: [PATCH] docs: remove Assisted-by references Message-ID: <20261013130134.GH4214@killaraus.ideasonboard.com> References: <20261009083137.3-1-sashal@kernel.org> <0914a106-bacf-4d95-854a-bfeefbff62a4@kernel.org> <1716819121.765615.1791890380179@kpc.webmail.kpnmail.nl> <20261013123853.GD4214@killaraus.ideasonboard.com> <353766590.785601.1791895821929@kpc.webmail.kpnmail.nl> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-doc@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <353766590.785601.1791895821929@kpc.webmail.kpnmail.nl> On Tue, Oct 13, 2026 at 02:50:21PM +0200, Jori Koolstra wrote: > > Op 13-10-2026 14:38 CEST schreef Laurent Pinchart: > > On Tue, Oct 13, 2026 at 01:19:40PM +0200, Jori Koolstra wrote: > > > > Op 12-10-2026 17:42 CEST schreef Lorenzo Stoakes (ARM) : > > > > > > > > +cc the participants from that thread FYI. The original patch is at [2]. > > > > > > Thanks, Lorenzo. > > > > > > > On Fri, Oct 09, 2026 at 12:05:06PM +0200, Krzysztof Kozlowski wrote: > > > > > On 09/10/2026 10:31, Sasha Levin wrote: > > > > > > The Maintainers Summit reached consensus to deprecate the Assisted-by > > > > > > tag. Remove the documentation requiring it. > > > > > > > > > > Please provide here some sort of arguments used in that summit > > > > > consensus/discussion. This basically reverts/changes previous consensus > > > > > [1], which is fine itself, but it lacks reasoning. > > > > > > > > > > [1] https://lore.kernel.org/workflows/2026070224-unholy-commode-cf45@gregkh/ > > > > > > > > Thanks for linking that! It is important to ack previous discussion on > > > > this. Also LWN article is up now at [3]. > > > > > > > > I'm less bothered than you might think by this change. > > > > > > > > The tag's useful for push back on review, but the only long-term strategy for > > > > slop is to aggressively ignore it. > > > > > > > > Linus has made that clear that that's fine. > > > > > > > > What kills the project is having 1,000 slop submissions that 2 or 3 people have > > > > to do something with. > > > > > > > > The only long-term solution to that is to hit mark read 1,000 times :) > > > > > > There's a way to nuke drive-by authors and that is to require them to do > > > some kind of "proof-of-effort." So you want to contribute to the kernel? > > > Good, come to one of the OSS conferences, or LPC, or have some well-known > > > maintainer vouch for you, or do the kernel mentorship program. The point > > > is not that this cannot be gamed, but that the "gaming" in itself requires > > > some kind of investment, like proof-of-work. > > > > > > We may miss the savant that for whatever reason cannot show up to a conference, > > > > We'll miss all the contributors who started small and put time and > > effort in learning. I'm pretty sure that's a majority of the people on > > the CC list, and it certainly includes myself. Making it much more > > difficult for true hackers to contribute to the kernel, including by > > requiring paying for travel to conferences, is the kind of policy that > > would make me stop contributing to the kernel. > > But you were there at LPC! It took a decade between my first kernel contribution and my first time at LPC. And luck played a great role there, it could easily have taken longer. > Sorry, was planning to go to your talk, but > couldn't :( . Would have loved to chat with you. > > I doubt how many people are like this. You have to contribute A LOT of > time to get to a meaningful level of understanding of even just one > subsystem And that's what people have been doing since the start of the kernel. > , even with LLM support. I know some people don't travel, but > I didn't suggest that conference attendance should be the only avenue > to participate. > > > > but Linux Foundation is already very supportive of funding people. > > > > How many people with very little history of kernel contributions has the > > LF funded ? > > Well, me, for instance :) I note a count of 1 out of thousands. -- Regards, Laurent Pinchart