public inbox for linux-ext4@vger.kernel.org
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Matthew Wilcox <willy@infradead.org>
To: John Garry <john.g.garry@oracle.com>
Cc: Dave Chinner <david@fromorbit.com>,
	Ojaswin Mujoo <ojaswin@linux.ibm.com>,
	linux-ext4@vger.kernel.org, Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu>,
	Ritesh Harjani <ritesh.list@gmail.com>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	"Darrick J . Wong" <djwong@kernel.org>,
	linux-block@vger.kernel.org, linux-xfs@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, dchinner@redhat.com
Subject: Re: [RFC 1/7] iomap: Don't fall back to buffered write if the write is atomic
Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2023 13:27:43 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <ZWnfT1+afsZ9JaZP@casper.infradead.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <85d1b27c-f4ef-43dd-8eed-f497817ab86d@oracle.com>

On Fri, Dec 01, 2023 at 10:42:57AM +0000, John Garry wrote:
> Sure, and I think that we need a better story for supporting buffered IO for
> atomic writes.
> 
> Currently we have:
> - man pages tell us RWF_ATOMIC is only supported for direct IO
> - statx gives atomic write unit min/max, not explicitly telling us it's for
> direct IO
> - RWF_ATOMIC is ignored for !O_DIRECT
> 
> So I am thinking of expanding statx support to enable querying of atomic
> write capabilities for buffered IO and direct IO separately.

Or ... we could support RWF_ATOMIC in the page cache?

I haven't particularly been following the atomic writes patchset, but
for filesystems which support large folios, we now create large folios
in the write path.  I see four problems to solve:

1. We might already have a smaller folio in the page cache from an
   earlier access,  We'd have to kick it out before creating a new folio
   that is the appropriate size.

2. We currently believe it's always OK to fall back to allocating smaller
   folios if memory allocation fails.  We'd need to change that policy
   (which we need to modify anyway for the bs>PS support).

3. We need to somewhere keep the information that writeback of this
   folio has to use the atomic commands.  Maybe it becomes a per-inode
   flag so that all writeback from this inode now uses the atomic
   commands?

4. If somebody does a weird thing like truncate/holepunch into the
   middle of the folio, we need to define what we do.  It's conceptually
   a bizarre thing to do, so I can't see any user actually wanting to
   do that ... but we need to define the semantics.

Maybe there are things I haven't thought of.  And of course, some
filesystems don't support large folios yet.

  reply	other threads:[~2023-12-01 13:27 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 32+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2023-11-30 13:53 [RFC 0/7] ext4: Allocator changes for atomic write support with DIO Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-11-30 13:53 ` [RFC 1/7] iomap: Don't fall back to buffered write if the write is atomic Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-11-30 21:10   ` Dave Chinner
2023-12-01 10:42     ` John Garry
2023-12-01 13:27       ` Matthew Wilcox [this message]
2023-12-01 19:06         ` John Garry
2023-12-01 22:07       ` Dave Chinner
2023-12-04  9:02         ` John Garry
2023-12-04 18:17           ` Darrick J. Wong
2023-12-04 18:34             ` John Garry
2023-12-07 12:43         ` John Garry
2023-11-30 13:53 ` [RFC 2/7] ext4: Factor out size and start prediction from ext4_mb_normalize_request() Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-11-30 13:53 ` [RFC 3/7] ext4: add aligned allocation support in mballoc Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-11-30 13:53 ` [RFC 4/7] ext4: allow inode preallocation for aligned alloc Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-11-30 13:53 ` [RFC 5/7] block: export blkdev_atomic_write_valid() and refactor api Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-12-01 10:47   ` John Garry
2023-12-11 10:57     ` Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-11-30 13:53 ` [RFC 6/7] ext4: Add aligned allocation support for atomic direct io Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-11-30 13:53 ` [RFC 7/7] ext4: Support atomic write for statx Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-12-04 10:36 ` [RFC 0/7] ext4: Allocator changes for atomic write support with DIO John Garry
2023-12-04 13:38   ` Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-12-04 14:44     ` John Garry
2023-12-11 10:54       ` Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-12-12  7:46         ` John Garry
2023-12-12 13:10           ` Christoph Hellwig
2023-12-12 15:16             ` Theodore Ts'o
2023-12-12 15:19               ` Christoph Hellwig
2023-12-12 16:10             ` John Garry
2023-12-13  5:59           ` Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-12-13  9:17             ` John Garry
2023-12-13  6:42         ` Ojaswin Mujoo
2023-12-13  9:20           ` John Garry

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=ZWnfT1+afsZ9JaZP@casper.infradead.org \
    --to=willy@infradead.org \
    --cc=david@fromorbit.com \
    --cc=dchinner@redhat.com \
    --cc=djwong@kernel.org \
    --cc=john.g.garry@oracle.com \
    --cc=linux-block@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=linux-ext4@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=linux-xfs@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=ojaswin@linux.ibm.com \
    --cc=ritesh.list@gmail.com \
    --cc=tytso@mit.edu \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox