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From: Daniel Phillips <phillips@phunq.net>
To: David Howells <dhowells@redhat.com>
Cc: Trond.Myklebust@netapp.com, chuck.lever@oracle.com,
	casey@schaufler-ca.com, nfsv4@linux-nfs.org,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org,
	selinux@tycho.nsa.gov, linux-security-module@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH 00/37] Permit filesystem local caching
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 02:26:26 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <200802260226.26984.phillips@phunq.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <24873.1203991250@redhat.com>

I need to respond to this in pieces... first the bit that is bugging
me:

> >   * two new page flags
> 
> I need to keep track of two bits of per-cached-page information:
> 
>  (1) This page is known by the cache, and that the cache must be informed if
>      the page is going to go away.

I still do not understand the life cycle of this bit.  What does the
cache do when it learns the page has gone away?  How is it informed?
Who owns the page cache in which such a page lives, the nfs client?
Filesystem that hosts the page?  A third page cache owned by the
cache itself?  (See my basic confusion about how many page cache
levels you have, below.)

Suppose one were to take a mundane approach to the persistent cache
problem instead of layering filesystems.  What you would do then is
change NFS's ->write_page and variants to fiddle the persistent
cache as well as the network, instead of just the network as now.
This fiddling could even consist of ->write calls to another
filesystem, though working directly with the bio interface would
yield the fastest, and therefore to my mind, best result.

In any case, you find out how to write the page to backing store by
asking the filesystem, which in the naive approach would be nfs
augmented with caching library calls.  The filesystem keeps its own
metadata around to know how to map the page to disk.  So again
naively, this metadata could tell the nfs client that the page is
not mapped to disk at all.  So I do not see what your per-page bit
is for, obviously because I do not fully understand your caching
scheme.  Which I could eventually find out by reading all the
patches but asking you is so much more fun :-)

By the way, how many levels of page caching for the same data are
there, is it:

  1) nfs client
  2) cache layer's own page cache
  3) filesystem hosting the cache

or just:

  1) nfs client page cache
  2) filesystem hosting the cache

I think it is the second, but that is already double caching, which
has got to hurt.

Regards,

Daniel

  reply	other threads:[~2008-02-26 10:26 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 69+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-02-20 16:05 [PATCH 00/37] Permit filesystem local caching David Howells
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 01/37] KEYS: Increase the payload size when instantiating a key David Howells
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 02/37] KEYS: Check starting keyring as part of search David Howells
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 03/37] KEYS: Allow the callout data to be passed as a blob rather than a string David Howells
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 04/37] KEYS: Add keyctl function to get a security label David Howells
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 05/37] Security: Change current->fs[ug]id to current_fs[ug]id() David Howells
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 06/37] Security: Separate task security context from task_struct David Howells
2008-02-22  4:47   ` Casey Schaufler
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 07/37] Security: De-embed task security record from task and use refcounting David Howells
2008-02-22  4:57   ` Casey Schaufler
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 08/37] Security: Add a kernel_service object class to SELinux David Howells
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 09/37] Security: Allow kernel services to override LSM settings for task actions David Howells
2008-02-22  5:06   ` Casey Schaufler
2008-02-22 13:06     ` David Howells
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 10/37] Security: Make NFSD work with detached security David Howells
2008-02-20 16:06 ` [PATCH 11/37] FS-Cache: Release page->private after failed readahead David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 12/37] FS-Cache: Recruit a couple of page flags for cache management David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 13/37] FS-Cache: Provide an add_wait_queue_tail() function David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 14/37] FS-Cache: Generic filesystem caching facility David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 15/37] CacheFiles: Add missing copy_page export for ia64 David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 16/37] CacheFiles: Be consistent about the use of mapping vs file->f_mapping in Ext3 David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 17/37] CacheFiles: Add a hook to write a single page of data to an inode David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 18/37] CacheFiles: Permit the page lock state to be monitored David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 19/37] CacheFiles: Export things for CacheFiles David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 20/37] CacheFiles: A cache that backs onto a mounted filesystem David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 21/37] NFS: Add comment banners to some NFS functions David Howells
2008-02-20 16:07 ` [PATCH 22/37] NFS: Add FS-Cache option bit and debug bit David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 23/37] NFS: Permit local filesystem caching to be enabled for NFS David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 24/37] NFS: Register NFS for caching and retrieve the top-level index David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 25/37] NFS: Define and create server-level objects David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 26/37] NFS: Define and create superblock-level objects David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 27/37] NFS: Define and create inode-level cache objects David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 28/37] NFS: Use local disk inode cache David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 29/37] NFS: Invalidate FsCache page flags when cache removed David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 30/37] NFS: Add some new I/O event counters for FS-Cache events David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 31/37] NFS: FS-Cache page management David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 32/37] NFS: Add read context retention for FS-Cache to call back with David Howells
2008-02-20 16:08 ` [PATCH 33/37] NFS: nfs_readpage_async() needs to be accessible as a fallback for local caching David Howells
2008-02-20 16:09 ` [PATCH 34/37] NFS: Read pages from FS-Cache into an NFS inode David Howells
2008-02-20 16:09 ` [PATCH 35/37] NFS: Store pages from an NFS inode into a local cache David Howells
2008-02-20 16:09 ` [PATCH 36/37] NFS: Display local caching state David Howells
2008-02-20 16:09 ` [PATCH 37/37] NFS: Add mount options to enable local caching on NFS David Howells
2008-02-20 19:58 ` [PATCH 00/37] Permit filesystem local caching Serge E. Hallyn
2008-02-20 20:11 ` David Howells
2008-02-21  3:07 ` Daniel Phillips
2008-02-21 12:31 ` David Howells
2008-02-21 14:55 ` David Howells
2008-02-21 15:17   ` Kevin Coffman
2008-02-21 22:44   ` Daniel Phillips
2008-02-21 22:52     ` Muntz, Daniel
2008-02-22  0:07   ` David Howells
2008-02-22  0:57     ` Daniel Phillips
2008-02-22 12:48     ` David Howells
2008-02-22 22:25       ` Daniel Phillips
2008-02-23  1:22       ` David Howells
2008-02-21 23:33 ` David Howells
2008-02-22 13:52   ` Chris Mason
2008-02-22 16:12   ` David Howells
2008-02-22 16:47   ` David Howells
2008-02-25 23:19   ` David Howells
2008-02-26  0:43     ` Daniel Phillips
2008-02-26  2:00     ` David Howells
2008-02-26 10:26       ` Daniel Phillips [this message]
2008-02-26 14:33       ` David Howells
2008-02-26 19:43         ` Daniel Phillips
2008-02-26 21:09         ` David Howells
2008-02-22 16:14 ` David Howells
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2008-02-22 16:01 Rick Macklem
2008-02-08 16:51 David Howells

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