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From: Matthew Wilcox <matthew@wil.cx>
To: jim owens <jowens@hp.com>
Cc: Theodore Tso <tytso@mit.edu>, Ric Wheeler <rwheeler@redhat.com>,
	Chris Mason <chris.mason@oracle.com>,
	James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@hansenpartnership.com>,
	"Martin K. Petersen" <martin.petersen@oracle.com>,
	Jens Axboe <jens.axboe@oracle.com>,
	David Woodhouse <dwmw2@infradead.org>,
	linux-scsi@vger.kernel.org, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org,
	Black_David@emc.com, Tom Coughlan <coughlan@redhat.com>
Subject: Re: thin provisioned LUN support
Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2008 12:48:08 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20081107194807.GI15439@parisc-linux.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <49149A88.4060902@hp.com>

On Fri, Nov 07, 2008 at 02:44:08PM -0500, jim owens wrote:
> To do that you kind of have to build a filesystem into the
> block layer to persistently store "mapped/unmapped blocks
> in chunk" and then do the "unmap-this-chunk" when a region
> is all unmapped.
> 
> 250 MB per 1TiB 512b sector disk for a simple 1-bit-per-sector
> state.  And that assumes you don't replicate it for safety.
> That is what the array vendors are trying to avoid by pushing
> it off to the OS.

And it's what the OS people are trying to avoid having to incorporate
by pushing back on the array vendors.

> Whoever supports thin provisioning better get their unmapping
> correct because those big customers will be looking for who
> to blame if they don't get all the features.

It's fairly clear that it's the array vendors at fault here.  They've
designed a shitty product and they're trying to get us to compensate.

-- 
Matthew Wilcox				Intel Open Source Technology Centre
"Bill, look, we understand that you're interested in selling us this
operating system, but compare it to ours.  We can't possibly take such
a retrograde step."

  reply	other threads:[~2008-11-07 19:48 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 105+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-11-06 14:43 thin provisioned LUN support Ric Wheeler
2008-11-06 15:17 ` James Bottomley
2008-11-06 15:24   ` David Woodhouse
2008-11-06 16:00     ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-06 16:40       ` Martin K. Petersen
2008-11-06 17:04         ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-06 17:15     ` Matthew Wilcox
2008-11-07 12:05     ` Jens Axboe
2008-11-07 12:14       ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-07 12:17         ` David Woodhouse
2008-11-07 12:19         ` Jens Axboe
2008-11-07 14:26           ` thin provisioned LUN support & file system allocation policy Ric Wheeler
2008-11-07 14:34             ` Matthew Wilcox
2008-11-07 14:45               ` Jörn Engel
2008-11-07 14:43             ` Theodore Tso
2008-11-07 14:54               ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-07 15:26                 ` jim owens
2008-11-07 15:31                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-11-07 15:35                     ` jim owens
2008-11-07 15:46                       ` Theodore Tso
2008-11-07 15:51                         ` Martin K. Petersen
2008-11-07 16:06                           ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-07 15:56                         ` James Bottomley
2008-11-07 15:36                     ` James Bottomley
2008-11-07 15:48                       ` David Woodhouse
2008-11-07 15:36                   ` Theodore Tso
2008-11-07 15:45                     ` Matthew Wilcox
2008-11-07 16:07                       ` jim owens
2008-11-07 16:12                         ` James Bottomley
2008-11-07 16:23                           ` jim owens
2008-11-07 16:02                   ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-07 14:55               ` Matthew Wilcox
2008-11-07 15:20         ` thin provisioned LUN support James Bottomley
2008-11-09 23:08           ` Dave Chinner
2008-11-09 23:37             ` James Bottomley
2008-11-10  0:33               ` Dave Chinner
2008-11-10 14:31                 ` James Bottomley
2008-11-07 15:49       ` Chris Mason
2008-11-07 16:00         ` Martin K. Petersen
2008-11-07 16:06           ` James Bottomley
2008-11-07 16:11             ` Chris Mason
2008-11-07 16:18               ` James Bottomley
2008-11-07 16:22                 ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-07 16:27                   ` James Bottomley
2008-11-07 16:28                   ` David Woodhouse
2008-11-07 17:22                 ` Chris Mason
2008-11-07 18:09                   ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-07 18:36                     ` Theodore Tso
2008-11-07 18:41                       ` Ric Wheeler
     [not found]                       ` <49148BDF.9050707@redhat.com>
2008-11-07 19:35                         ` Theodore Tso
2008-11-07 19:55                           ` Martin K. Petersen
2008-11-07 20:19                             ` Theodore Tso
2008-11-07 20:21                               ` Matthew Wilcox
     [not found]                               ` <20081107202149.GJ15439@parisc-linux.org>
2008-11-07 20:26                                 ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-07 20:48                                   ` Chris Mason
2008-11-07 21:04                                     ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-07 21:13                                     ` Theodore Tso
2008-11-07 20:42                                 ` Theodore Tso
2008-11-07 21:06                               ` Martin K. Petersen
2008-11-07 20:37                             ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-10  2:44                               ` Black_David
2008-11-10  2:36                           ` Black_David
2008-11-07 19:44                       ` jim owens
2008-11-07 19:48                         ` Matthew Wilcox [this message]
2008-11-07 19:50                         ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-09 23:36           ` Dave Chinner
2008-11-10  3:40             ` Thin provisioning & arrays Black_David
2008-11-10  8:31               ` Dave Chinner
2008-11-10  9:59                 ` David Woodhouse
2008-11-10 13:30                   ` Matthew Wilcox
2008-11-10 13:36                     ` Jens Axboe
2008-11-10 17:05                   ` UNMAP is a hint Black_David
2008-11-10 17:30                     ` Matthew Wilcox
2008-11-10 17:56                       ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-10 22:18                   ` Thin provisioning & arrays Dave Chinner
2008-11-11  1:23                     ` Black_David
2008-11-11  2:09                       ` Keith Owens
2008-11-11 13:59                         ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-11 14:55                           ` jim owens
2008-11-11 15:38                             ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-11 15:59                               ` jim owens
2008-11-11 16:25                                 ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-11 16:53                                   ` jim owens
2008-11-11 23:08                             ` Dave Chinner
2008-11-11 23:52                               ` jim owens
2008-11-11 22:49                       ` Dave Chinner
2008-11-06 15:27 ` thin provisioned LUN support jim owens
2008-11-06 15:57   ` jim owens
2008-11-06 16:21     ` James Bottomley
     [not found] ` <yq1d4h8nao5.fsf@sermon.lab.mkp.net>
2008-11-06 15:42   ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-06 15:57     ` David Woodhouse
2008-11-06 22:36 ` Dave Chinner
2008-11-06 22:55   ` Ric Wheeler
     [not found]   ` <491375E9.7020707@redhat.com>
2008-11-06 23:06     ` James Bottomley
2008-11-06 23:10       ` Ric Wheeler
2008-11-06 23:26         ` James Bottomley
2008-11-06 23:32 ` thin provisioned LUN support - T10 activity Black_David
2008-11-07 11:59 ` thin provisioned LUN support Artem Bityutskiy
2008-11-10 20:39 ` Aggregating discard requests in the filesystem Matthew Wilcox
2008-11-10 20:44   ` Chris Mason
2008-11-11  0:12   ` Brad Boyer
2008-11-11 15:25     ` jim owens
2008-11-11 16:40 ` thin provisioned LUN support Christoph Hellwig
2008-11-11 17:07   ` jim owens
2008-11-11 17:33     ` Christoph Hellwig

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