From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from fout-b5-smtp.messagingengine.com (fout-b5-smtp.messagingengine.com [202.12.124.148]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6A6DF2580CA; Mon, 1 Sep 2025 19:57:43 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=202.12.124.148 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1756756667; cv=none; b=NR6BpqXp2biprm2Kw7y5iTj3t2dRyjczEijk8pbWtTgsLMpd9N+Av8Ry68XwpsgSUBEcD1muiOYd4cvM4Y2zxz7/dlrzIrw5toxDvjr19MO/9n4t0k8fBJ9sbq1c4KDNA2HUipAl3A1fvcpqaJPZhxt+ZtJB022f5UvL4vrIDKI= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1756756667; c=relaxed/simple; bh=Bsw8CaxEROMumMzgU1S4U1vyDdXzlPluKDsgkqNVJpc=; h=MIME-Version:Date:From:To:Cc:Message-Id:In-Reply-To:References: Subject:Content-Type; b=GFpSn05+ys+wa6/lh37eTTotd/eJHFREi/tgnFC6qZJQNQxWyUFz47/Bd5PTvabH4zoK2MOfJlAVi3rs3BZUg6+WvQFDqaXzqVSNIUxkRptgLqdo3yr1iJZMIGxBsd/4dtwOnE0x4ZWhQJkpFabz1nkMTch+0c3DmbqZRLCm4HQ= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=verbum.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=verbum.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=verbum.org header.i=@verbum.org header.b=AR7943HS; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.i=@messagingengine.com header.b=oFkWaCeb; arc=none smtp.client-ip=202.12.124.148 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=verbum.org Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=verbum.org Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=verbum.org header.i=@verbum.org header.b="AR7943HS"; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.i=@messagingengine.com header.b="oFkWaCeb" Received: from phl-compute-12.internal (phl-compute-12.internal [10.202.2.52]) by mailfout.stl.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00BAC1D002C8; Mon, 1 Sep 2025 15:57:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from phl-imap-15 ([10.202.2.104]) by phl-compute-12.internal (MEProxy); Mon, 01 Sep 2025 15:57:43 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=verbum.org; h=cc :cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type:content-type:date :date:from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :references:reply-to:subject:subject:to:to; s=fm1; t=1756756662; x=1756843062; bh=+wEl+0r45x6y1/M2f4wYxqvisWrDMs5TnlDtxIfnbLY=; b= AR7943HSG1uW1nPvp9Cmm9Pu71nsn8uHaqB221/hWbjvVD+kFUOKwKmeuTlecl0R hbpL+orWIdMeBHHAo1LZYx2+dwTTtYYWXpebXXw/3Ay4REWzwyXvNifDKyk5qNY+ NtEJKuGogiV5nQ3033tcl2yigEA54b+h4dbhHjDV8QJnPpeutV2/zV0u8az8u18B jnA89BghL3tw9N3RY9FSqjTbJztnLbQyoHsyh6AWlTeJgFPUJMnMFo+HpjzZIWJd JFcGX8xkWEc6EldW/Y+BFdJ26r/Y/hepOYAqqxlN6rtJ9sqlk//L4g7HmO+35HuD XzhvehiTJmHGFZQBWuGE/g== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-transfer-encoding :content-type:content-type:date:date:feedback-id:feedback-id :from:from:in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :references:reply-to:subject:subject:to:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; t=1756756662; x= 1756843062; bh=+wEl+0r45x6y1/M2f4wYxqvisWrDMs5TnlDtxIfnbLY=; b=o FkWaCebXTTmYy2kMxR3nV3f03y7FqJix7KqZ6hidwX3SOHy2fnvAE6B9QEHl79A9 ugXqjxdh+h10THx5FIwhY4mTDpIYFm9EEFKoYIWkY7xahKsJG5yO/Ftm8emo3AD4 juVyRQoAYV+gIXyDjDKRF2VVFpbUGXQXyG4x+GnrmuP7xWvDD6dB0I/D80tkZQ51 dWSyE7HdMhSTEjNNI7zlgzH4ZCRafwaIDTvaZPIjLiGnuqKC1jUfRnyFOzK2ct2m Xon11BPM0oycLBMh4QLZJwqluP2Vm4QGIjh9hQHXvJrEMVOn4F3Za/hVfr2xwUwh 37OGemFRVwg3trZSJlGAg== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeeffedrtdefgdduleeftdehucetufdoteggodetrf dotffvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgenuceu rghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmnecujf gurhepofggfffhvfevkfgjfhfutgfgsehtjeertdertddtnecuhfhrohhmpedfveholhhi nhcuhggrlhhtvghrshdfuceofigrlhhtvghrshesvhgvrhgsuhhmrdhorhhgqeenucggtf frrghtthgvrhhnpeehgeeutdefleeutdfhieejfffhteetuddvhfegudekhfejiedulefh ffehheffueenucffohhmrghinheplhifnhdrnhgvthenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpe dtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpeifrghlthgvrhhssehvvghrsghumhdrohhr ghdpnhgspghrtghpthhtohepjedpmhhouggvpehsmhhtphhouhhtpdhrtghpthhtohepmh hjghhuiihikhesghhmrghilhdrtghomhdprhgtphhtthhopegrmhhonhgrkhhovhesihhs phhrrghsrdhruhdprhgtphhtthhopegsrhgruhhnvghrsehkvghrnhgvlhdrohhrghdprh gtphhtthhopehjrggtkhesshhushgvrdgtiidprhgtphhtthhopehlihhnuhigqdhfshgu vghvvghlsehvghgvrhdrkhgvrhhnvghlrdhorhhgpdhrtghpthhtoheplhhinhhugidqkh gvrhhnvghlsehvghgvrhdrkhgvrhhnvghlrdhorhhgpdhrtghpthhtohepvhhirhhoseii vghnihhvrdhlihhnuhigrdhorhhgrdhukh X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: ibe7c40e9:Fastmail Received: by mailuser.phl.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id EAB737840CC; Mon, 1 Sep 2025 15:57:41 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-ThreadId: AkTvZmR_UAfN Date: Mon, 01 Sep 2025 15:57:21 -0400 From: "Colin Walters" To: "Mateusz Guzik" , "Alexander Monakov" Cc: linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, "Al Viro" , "Christian Brauner" , "Jan Kara" , linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org Message-Id: <7a2513ea-a144-4981-906a-7036d92d4dcb@app.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: References: <6e60aa72-94ef-9de2-a54c-ffd91fcc4711@ispras.ru> Subject: Re: ETXTBSY window in __fput Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Mon, Sep 1, 2025, at 2:39 PM, Mateusz Guzik wrote: > > The O_CLOFORM idea was accepted into POSIX and recent-ish implemented in > all the BSDs (no, really) and illumos, but got NAKed in Linux. It's also > a part of pig's attire so I think that's the right call. Do you have a reference handy for that NAK? > To that end, my sketch of a suggestion boils down to a new API which > allows you to construct a new process one step at a time In this vein I think io_uring_spawn work sounds like the best: https://lwn.net/Articles/908268/ However...if we predicate any solution to this problem on changing every single codebase which is spawning processes, it's going to take a long time. I think changing the few special cases around "sealing" (fsverity and write + fexecve()) is more tractable.