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Mon, 11 Aug 2025 17:04:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2025 00:04:53 +0300 Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: [GIT PULL] bcachefs changes for 6.17 To: Kent Overstreet Cc: admin@aquinas.su, linux-bcachefs@vger.kernel.org, linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, list-bcachefs@carlthompson.net, malte.schroeder@tnxip.de, torvalds@linux-foundation.org References: <3ik3h6hfm4v2y3rtpjshk5y4wlm5n366overw2lp72qk5izizw@k6vxp22uwnwa> <55e623db-ff03-4d33-98d1-1042106e83c6@ftml.net> Content-Language: en-US From: Konstantin Shelekhin In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 11/08/2025 17:26, Kent Overstreet wrote: > Konstantin, please tell me what you're basing this on. This, for example: - https://lore.kernel.org/all/9db17620-4b93-4c01-b7f8-ecab83b12d0f@kernel.dk/ - https://lore.kernel.org/all/20250308155011.1742461-1-kent.overstreet@linux.dev/ I've just lurked around lore for a couple of minutes. > The claims I've been hearing have simply lacked any kind of specifics; if there's people I'd pissed off for no reason, I would've been happy to apologize, but I'm not aware of the incidences you're claiming - not within a year or more; I have made real efforts to tone things down. Both links are four months old. > On the other hand, for the only incidences I can remotely refer to in the past year and a half, there has been: > > - the mm developer who started outright swearing at me on IRC in a > discussion about assertions That is very unfortunate. > - the block layer developer who went on a four email rant where he, > charitably, misread the spec or the patchset or both; all this over a > patch to simply bring a warning in line with the actual NVME and SCSI > specs. My team has contributed to NVMe and SCSI subsystems, so I have some experience working with Jens, Martin and Christoph. Nobody on my team had this level of drama, even when we were in disagreement about specs or intended behavior. > - and reference to an incident at LSF, but the only noteworthy event > that I can recall at the last LSF (a year and a half ago) was where a > filesystem developer chased a Rust developer out of the community. > > So: what am I supposed to make of all this? That you're trying to excuse your communication issues with other people's communication issues? > To an outsider, I don't think any of this looks like a reasonable or > measured response, or professional behaviour. The problems with toxic > behaviour have been around long before I was prominent, and they're > still in evidence. Again, "Timmy also did that" is not a very good excuse for a grown up adult. > It is not reasonable or professional to jump from professional criticism > of code and work to personal attacks: it is our job to be critical of > our own and each other's code, and while that may bring up strong > feelings when we feel our work is attacked, that does not mean that it > is appropriate to lash out. This is _NOT_ about the code. That's the essence of your struggles. Forget about the code, the code is not the issue here. Communication is. > As a reminder, this all stems from a single patch, purely internal to > fs/bcachefs/, that was a critical, data integrity hotfix. But this does not matter. No matter how important your fix is. > There has been a real pattern of hyper reactive, dramatic responses to > bugfixes in the bcachefs pull requests, all the way up to full blown > repeated threats of removing it from the kernel, and it's been toxic. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Piss off a maintainer long enough, he will refuse to work with you. Who would've thought, eh? > And it's happening again, complete with full blown rants right off the > bat in the private maintainer thread about not trusting my work (and I > have provided data and comparisons with btrfs specifically to rebut > that), all the way to "everyone hates you and you need therapy". That is > not reasonable or constructive. You seem to ignore what people keep telling you: _COMMUNICATION_ is the problem, not the _CODE_. So arguments about how btrfs performs compared to bcachefs do not matter. Your result is not the issue, the journey with you is.