From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Helge Deller Date: Thu, 11 May 2023 17:02:19 +0000 Subject: Re: [PATCH v6 1/6] fbdev/matrox: Remove trailing whitespaces Message-Id: <1c7ca6d3-76d7-047b-42ac-716e12946f90@gmx.de> List-Id: References: <20230510110557.14343-1-tzimmermann@suse.de> <20230510110557.14343-2-tzimmermann@suse.de> <0e13efbf-9a48-6e70-fdf3-8290f28c6dc7@189.cn> <15fe1489-f0fa-bbf6-ec08-a270bd4f1559@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Thomas Zimmermann , Sui Jingfeng <15330273260@189.cn>, geert@linux-m68k.org, javierm@redhat.com, daniel@ffwll.ch, vgupta@kernel.org, chenhuacai@kernel.org, kernel@xen0n.name, davem@davemloft.net, arnd@arndb.de, sam@ravnborg.org Cc: linux-fbdev@vger.kernel.org, dri-devel@lists.freedesktop.org, linux-arch@vger.kernel.org, linux-snps-arc@lists.infradead.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-ia64@vger.kernel.org, loongarch@lists.linux.dev, linux-m68k@lists.linux-m68k.org, sparclinux@vger.kernel.org, linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org, linux-parisc@vger.kernel.org On 5/11/23 16:27, Thomas Zimmermann wrote: >>> But the work I do within fbdev is mostly for improving DRM. >> >> Sure. >> >>> For the >>> other issues in this file, I don't think that matroxfb should even be >>> around any longer. Fbdev has been deprecated for a long time. But a >>> small number of drivers are still in use and we still need its >>> framebuffer console. So someone should either put significant effort >>> into maintaining fbdev, or it should be phased out. But neither is >>> happening. >> >> You're wrong. > > I'm not. I don't claim that these drivers are all broken. But fbdev > as a whole is bit-rotting and no one attempts to address this. There > are several recent examples of this: > > * I recently send out a 100-patches series to improve parameter > parsing and avoid memory leaks. That got shot down. I didn't attempt > to support parameter parsing for module builds. Your work is appreciated and it wasn't shot down, but it wasn't perfect either. > * There's been a 15-yrs old bug in fbdev's read/write where they > return an incorrect value. ? > * See the other discussion on this patchset on the state of hitfb. > > * The fbdev code I recently cleaned up had bugs in how it uses some > of fbdev's basic building blocks (see the screen_base/screen_buffer > confusion). As you said... some (little-used/outdated) drivers may have issues which of course show up if one starts to clean up, as you do. On a per-driver basis it can make sense to drop a specific driver. > * has been in the tree since 2009 and no one > attempted to include it until now. > > None of this is a sign of good maintenance. > As I've worked on DRM's fbdev emulation a lot, I try to be a good > kernel citizen and clean up in fbdev as well when I see a problem.> But I'd really like to see most of these drivers being moved into > staging and deleted soon afterwards. Users will complain about those > drivers that are really still required. Those might be worth to spend > effort on. I'd really like to see a way forward and get the required drivers over to DRM, e.g. based on your simpledrm driver. If there is a way to get basic on-screen 2D bitblt and fillrect support, it would drop the need for most of the fbdev drivers. The current way of bitblt'ing from a buffer on regular basis istoo slow for such older cards. Even on new hardware in emulators there is a big slowdown visible. >> You don't mention that for most older machines DRM isn't an >> acceptable way to go due to it's limitations, e.g. it's low-speed >> due to missing 2D-acceleration for older cards and and it's >> incapability to change screen resolution at runtime (just to name >> two of the bigger limitations here). > > You can change resolution at runtime; just not through fbdev ioctls. > There's no technical limitation here. No one found any use for this, > so it's not there. fbdev drivers would need that when ported to DRM. >> So, unless we somehow find a good way to move such drivers over to >> DRM (with a set of minimal 2D acceleration), they are still >> important. > > 2d acceleration is mostly useful for the framebuffer console. and X11 > You can > do that with DRM and drivers have (nouveau). It just didn't make a > meaningful difference in most cases. if nouveau got it, can't it be done for simpledrm in a generic way too? >> Actually, I just did test matroxfb and pm2fb successfully a few >> days back, and they worked. For some smaller issues I've prepared >> patches, which are on hold due conflicts with your latest >> file-move-around- and whitespace-changes which are partly in >> drm-misc. And I do have some upcoming additional patches for >> console support. Helge