From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on aws-us-west-2-korg-lkml-1.web.codeaurora.org Received: from vger.kernel.org (vger.kernel.org [23.128.96.18]) by smtp.lore.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 582ECEB64DC for ; Sun, 16 Jul 2023 03:08:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: (majordomo@vger.kernel.org) by vger.kernel.org via listexpand id S229819AbjGPDIv (ORCPT ); Sat, 15 Jul 2023 23:08:51 -0400 Received: from lindbergh.monkeyblade.net ([23.128.96.19]:54854 "EHLO lindbergh.monkeyblade.net" rhost-flags-OK-OK-OK-OK) by vger.kernel.org with ESMTP id S229852AbjGPDH7 (ORCPT ); Sat, 15 Jul 2023 23:07:59 -0400 Received: from dfw.source.kernel.org (dfw.source.kernel.org [IPv6:2604:1380:4641:c500::1]) by lindbergh.monkeyblade.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5719E10D7 for ; Sat, 15 Jul 2023 20:07:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.kernel.org (relay.kernel.org [52.25.139.140]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by dfw.source.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B9AC460BF9 for ; Sun, 16 Jul 2023 03:07:56 +0000 (UTC) Received: by smtp.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4607BC433C8; Sun, 16 Jul 2023 03:07:55 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=kernel.org; s=k20201202; t=1689476876; bh=phANgoMNRxxYh1IaXkvVee8hCLyHKB/5XWL2+XoKL3E=; h=Date:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:In-Reply-To:From; b=NwqKy6O7I5FlQGfMztQFfQZJ9+mytV1wjh2lhXq66kcZpMN1gczbrsNx/9GZaPk1g QCga9s0p9P8TIUFwd66oZLX8PYdNOYcy1IDrGkM18ZN5fn5OVKg1tjgkLGFVMq1hTj ohcBCOL+nj0SSO84FADkTwNpBvQtD4djHR0w7Sebzk8xrZ5pf2cwP1mAifIAUOSB+r lQQtNNCoAeywVVtxK1VJ4xAa2vWh+/PkxDHjlAGorDZe/bJkLTZ8IzV+Y2jflEIxUM YDy/sBP4gcqpo1tdFx8pl5k5nreNOSj9YgjLZgnK+1ELyltGvkUHLQ7OlWQ/NO7xX3 6bzgYfZMNiq3Q== Message-ID: <705c8a8e-be97-29e7-da7b-5a0dab0e934c@kernel.org> Date: Sun, 16 Jul 2023 05:07:45 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.12.0 Subject: Re: [PATCH] recv.2: msg_iovec / MSG_ERRQUEUE / -v To: "G. Branden Robinson" Cc: linux-man@vger.kernel.org, Rob Linden References: <20230715195934.yigz5fz6ulkxktaa@illithid> <567cd883-412f-6b23-92c6-e7ea51fd7ebd@kernel.org> <20230716023432.eolrrjeiilr63tb4@illithid> Content-Language: en-US From: Alejandro Colomar Organization: Linux In-Reply-To: <20230716023432.eolrrjeiilr63tb4@illithid> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------IGT38SkAXEG35AelTFMqgSSi" Precedence: bulk List-ID: X-Mailing-List: linux-man@vger.kernel.org This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --------------IGT38SkAXEG35AelTFMqgSSi Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------TosQMPR7AmjRNCUGFurLbsTx"; protected-headers="v1" From: Alejandro Colomar To: "G. Branden Robinson" Cc: linux-man@vger.kernel.org, Rob Linden Message-ID: <705c8a8e-be97-29e7-da7b-5a0dab0e934c@kernel.org> Subject: Re: [PATCH] recv.2: msg_iovec / MSG_ERRQUEUE / -v References: <20230715195934.yigz5fz6ulkxktaa@illithid> <567cd883-412f-6b23-92c6-e7ea51fd7ebd@kernel.org> <20230716023432.eolrrjeiilr63tb4@illithid> In-Reply-To: <20230716023432.eolrrjeiilr63tb4@illithid> --------------TosQMPR7AmjRNCUGFurLbsTx Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, On 2023-07-16 04:34, G. Branden Robinson wrote: [...] > Because natural language demands a bit of Postel's Law, the foregoing > are generally understood by English speakers despite their non-standard= > structure. >=20 [...] >> BTW, that's the only case where it says to not use hyphens, and since >> by being alone it's necessarily not following a noun, I'd say it >> doesn't fall in this rule, and so a hyphen would be deserved. >=20 > I'd agree. I cite authorities only because I cannot expect people to > take only my word at such things. My authority as a grammarian is > limited. Unlike some, I don't have God and Ayn Rand for parents. And yet your words make more sense than those of the "authorities". ;) >=20 >> I don't see reasons to avoid it in the links above. >> >> So, I'm tending to conclude that it's necessary, or at least useful or= >> tasteful. Please quote the relevant parts if you disagree. I should have said, or decree their authority rescinded in our territorie= s. They no authority here no mo. :D >=20 > Recalling the case at issue: >=20 > .BR MSG_ERRQUEUE " (" recvmsg "() only; since Linux 2.2)" >=20 > I would find the addition of a hyphen before "only" to be superfluous. > As I said before, it disambiguates nothing. Further, if any of these > annotations ever has to be compounded, as in a man page that documents > several functions but requires annotation only for a subset of them, th= e > use of hyphens as you intend is liable to add clutter. >=20 > .BR MSG_BAZQUEUE " (" foomsg "()-, " barmsg "()-only; since Linux 7.99)= " >=20 > Consider also the possibility that you may want to invert set > membership; perhaps 6 out of 7 functions in a page accept a certain > parameter. >=20 > .BR MSG_BAZQUEUE " (not " quxmsg "(); since Linux 7.99)" >=20 > There is no correct place for a hyphen here. Yeah, a hyphen is better omitted for your reasons. --- Mr. Sed project: >=20 > Will do. I've gotten sidetracked by the great automated "Mr. Sed"[1] > project, which turns out to have some prerequisites if I am to > demonstrate no changes in formatted text as I intend. >=20 > Early findings: >=20 > 1. I think I have raised warnings to this list before about > manipulating adjustment and hyphenation outside of table regions > with `ad` and `hy` requests; the Linux man-pages do so > systematically around hundreds of tables, attempting (but failing) > to (reliably) "reset" them after tables, often with miserable > results. Fixing this is a separate, prior sed(1) project. Great. >=20 > 2. An ".sp 1" hack, also after tables, to work around a groff > pre-1.23.0 bug is also not necessary and the time to sweep it away > is near. While it may not be necessary, I'm all-in for killing such a workaround ASAP, to avoid contributors from imitating it. Cheers, Alex > I may not _have_ to do this one to satisfy "Mr. Sed", > though. I will keep you advised. >=20 > Regards, > Branden >=20 > [1] the rewrite of man page cross references to use the new groff 1.23.= 0 > `MR` macro, a feature I have written about on this list before and > which is covered in the release announcement sent here earlier this= > month by Bertrand Garrigues --=20 GPG key fingerprint: A9348594CE31283A826FBDD8D57633D441E25BB5 --------------TosQMPR7AmjRNCUGFurLbsTx-- --------------IGT38SkAXEG35AelTFMqgSSi Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="OpenPGP_signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="OpenPGP_signature" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEE6jqH8KTroDDkXfJAnowa+77/2zIFAmSzXwEACgkQnowa+77/ 2zKRUw//cgvLVDdie85bmpv3fUu1SoXBVWqAcQbAg1mdw+flylMWquOafj34CFBa 8IrfTyd+wddrVQxPVyRIcLs6+Uu/wIccZYWbVdYNnIaR/Mw+aWyao4Uw0ei2kZLN q0lcF2F+ofU+n+258UuCaeiRDji1zmqqMC4M9Fb9kRJdfVlFzwSi/rTNLeBS7BM0 AZhbIFYCrubzSjqRry4yII0ki5aL/iaTtoUdfhpRFZe/FGaOWm7OimPUVVqoXJZR mEOqDy40RtDJlPOw0E9QUATarf9ErXv8T9w+iOrqc6OLfofVZsm+TrS+sBx3zTCO ULXNnRxe8TWPLPGjLnHJ+3ObiAd2pIhfXwLCN7Sh7LYauof7HIeeg2AGKnDy7f/u U//yWYHaElatPgNjW9UStY1LLBE1MSu4VbHd289RtIGtobLZFwY4dk71rq15CcuM BNQM8rOvyYbWbVtssemw5y7IDQJPyDJ9o24mV9YxDxxLEkvWE0LvQu8ryr2h8AZe pOD9Cm5W2P03DTTTb5XEhhmwBG047/RJzXq3Ig5zWqWcjrk6L0A4JeAedSdk5sXV GMhNqgR9wU84gHCMcYwIr6zFgOBIRXQb7L+VSXtny5hsIsJOHZO4K847QaOA21w3 vpgTP5X/rbaICb1GlQdmdL8D2sYMEf/IO+0kVl4GAWKvxLeZav8= =H+dR -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------IGT38SkAXEG35AelTFMqgSSi--