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* [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes
@ 2025-12-30  6:41 seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 1/4] man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section seth.i.mcdonald
                   ` (4 more replies)
  0 siblings, 5 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: seth.i.mcdonald @ 2025-12-30  6:41 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Alejandro Colomar; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>

Hello,

Here's just a few minor fixes I came across.

Hopefully (fingers crossed) the patches will remain intact this time. If
so, I may be able to begin sending out some patches for the updated
HISTORY sections (currently at 109).

Seth McDonald (4):
  man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section
  sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
  man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix
  man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix

 man/man2/syscall.2            | 3 ++-
 man/man2/sysctl.2             | 3 +--
 man/man2/utime.2              | 2 +-
 man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const | 4 ++--
 4 files changed, 6 insertions(+), 6 deletions(-)

Range-diff against v0:
-:  ---------- > 1:  a2a2a51ede man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section
-:  ---------- > 2:  1477de655f sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
-:  ---------- > 3:  fad6d60041 man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix
-:  ---------- > 4:  2f33ba3b5b man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix
-- 
2.47.3


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* [PATCH v1 1/4] man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section
  2025-12-30  6:41 [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes seth.i.mcdonald
@ 2025-12-30  6:42 ` seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-31 13:46   ` Alejandro Colomar
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix seth.i.mcdonald
                   ` (3 subsequent siblings)
  4 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: seth.i.mcdonald @ 2025-12-30  6:42 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Alejandro Colomar; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>

Move the description of syscall(2)'s first appearance from NOTES to a
new HISTORY section.

Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
---
 man/man2/syscall.2 | 3 ++-
 1 file changed, 2 insertions(+), 1 deletion(-)

diff --git a/man/man2/syscall.2 b/man/man2/syscall.2
index be645c0f4a..54385cdfba 100644
--- a/man/man2/syscall.2
+++ b/man/man2/syscall.2
@@ -62,10 +62,11 @@ .SH ERRORS
 The requested system call number is not implemented.
 .P
 Other errors are specific to the invoked system call.
-.SH NOTES
+.SH HISTORY
 .BR syscall ()
 first appeared in
 4BSD.
+.SH NOTES
 .SS Architecture-specific requirements
 Each architecture ABI has its own requirements on how
 system call arguments are passed to the kernel.
-- 
2.47.3


^ permalink raw reply related	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
  2025-12-30  6:41 [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 1/4] man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section seth.i.mcdonald
@ 2025-12-30  6:42 ` seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-30  6:59   ` Collin Funk
  2025-12-31 13:46   ` [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix Alejandro Colomar
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 3/4] man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix seth.i.mcdonald
                   ` (2 subsequent siblings)
  4 siblings, 2 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: seth.i.mcdonald @ 2025-12-30  6:42 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Alejandro Colomar; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>

Include 4.4BSD in the initial list in HISTORY, rather than stating the
function's origin in 4.4BSD as a full sentence. This is more concise and
consistent with other man pages.

Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
---
 man/man2/sysctl.2 | 3 +--
 1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 2 deletions(-)

diff --git a/man/man2/sysctl.2 b/man/man2/sysctl.2
index c59acff553..6566c4f5be 100644
--- a/man/man2/sysctl.2
+++ b/man/man2/sysctl.2
@@ -73,11 +73,10 @@ .SH ERRORS
 .SH STANDARDS
 Linux.
 .SH HISTORY
+4.4BSD,
 Linux 1.3.57.
 Removed in Linux 5.5, glibc 2.32.
 .P
-It originated in
-4.4BSD.
 Only Linux has the
 .I /proc/sys
 mirror, and the object naming schemes differ between Linux and 4.4BSD,
-- 
2.47.3


^ permalink raw reply related	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* [PATCH v1 3/4] man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix
  2025-12-30  6:41 [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 1/4] man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix seth.i.mcdonald
@ 2025-12-30  6:42 ` seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-31 13:45   ` Alejandro Colomar
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 4/4] man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-31 13:48 ` [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes Alejandro Colomar
  4 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: seth.i.mcdonald @ 2025-12-30  6:42 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Alejandro Colomar; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>

Increments the indentation of the times parameter in the utimes(2)
prototype by one space.

Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
---
 man/man2/utime.2 | 2 +-
 1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-)

diff --git a/man/man2/utime.2 b/man/man2/utime.2
index 94307a5b90..e044f15b06 100644
--- a/man/man2/utime.2
+++ b/man/man2/utime.2
@@ -18,7 +18,7 @@ .SH SYNOPSIS
 .B #include <sys/time.h>
 .P
 .BI "int utimes(const char *" path ,
-.BI "          const struct timeval " times "[_Nullable 2]);"
+.BI "           const struct timeval " times "[_Nullable 2]);"
 .fi
 .SH DESCRIPTION
 .B Note:
-- 
2.47.3


^ permalink raw reply related	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* [PATCH v1 4/4] man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix
  2025-12-30  6:41 [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes seth.i.mcdonald
                   ` (2 preceding siblings ...)
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 3/4] man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix seth.i.mcdonald
@ 2025-12-30  6:42 ` seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-31 13:47   ` Alejandro Colomar
  2025-12-31 13:48 ` [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes Alejandro Colomar
  4 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: seth.i.mcdonald @ 2025-12-30  6:42 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Alejandro Colomar; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>

The G and S do look surprisingly similar...

Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
---
 man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const | 4 ++--
 1 file changed, 2 insertions(+), 2 deletions(-)

diff --git a/man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const b/man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const
index 3964cb7fd1..cd99611666 100644
--- a/man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const
+++ b/man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const
@@ -458,13 +458,13 @@ .SH HISTORY
 .TP
 .B F_GETOWN_EX
 .TQ
-.B F_GETOWN_EX
+.B F_SETOWN_EX
 POSIX.1-2024.
 Linux 2.6.32.
 .TP
 .B F_GETSIG
 .TQ
-.B F_GETSIG
+.B F_SETSIG
 Linux.
 .SH BUGS
 .SS F_GETOWN
-- 
2.47.3


^ permalink raw reply related	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix seth.i.mcdonald
@ 2025-12-30  6:59   ` Collin Funk
  2025-12-30  7:18     ` Seth McDonald
  2025-12-30  7:22     ` Is 2.11BSD < 4BSD? It depends. (was: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix) G. Branden Robinson
  2025-12-31 13:46   ` [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix Alejandro Colomar
  1 sibling, 2 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Collin Funk @ 2025-12-30  6:59 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: seth.i.mcdonald; +Cc: Alejandro Colomar, Seth McDonald, linux-man

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 990 bytes --]

seth.i.mcdonald@gmail.com writes:

> From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
>
> Include 4.4BSD in the initial list in HISTORY, rather than stating the
> function's origin in 4.4BSD as a full sentence. This is more concise and
> consistent with other man pages.
>
> Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> ---
>  man/man2/sysctl.2 | 3 +--
>  1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 2 deletions(-)
>
> diff --git a/man/man2/sysctl.2 b/man/man2/sysctl.2
> index c59acff553..6566c4f5be 100644
> --- a/man/man2/sysctl.2
> +++ b/man/man2/sysctl.2
> @@ -73,11 +73,10 @@ .SH ERRORS
>  .SH STANDARDS
>  Linux.
>  .SH HISTORY
> +4.4BSD,
>  Linux 1.3.57.
>  Removed in Linux 5.5, glibc 2.32.
>  .P
> -It originated in
> -4.4BSD.
>  Only Linux has the
>  .I /proc/sys
>  mirror, and the object naming schemes differ between Linux and 4.4BSD,

It actually existed before 4.4BSD. It existed in 2.11BSD at least [1].

Collin

[1] https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=2.11BSD/src/man/man3/sysctl.3

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
  2025-12-30  6:59   ` Collin Funk
@ 2025-12-30  7:18     ` Seth McDonald
  2025-12-30  7:27       ` G. Branden Robinson
  2025-12-30  7:22     ` Is 2.11BSD < 4BSD? It depends. (was: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix) G. Branden Robinson
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Seth McDonald @ 2025-12-30  7:18 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Collin Funk; +Cc: Alejandro Colomar, linux-man


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On Tuesday, 30 December 2025 at 16:59, Collin Funk <collin.funk1@gmail.com> wrote:
> seth.i.mcdonald@gmail.com writes:
>
> > From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> >
> > Include 4.4BSD in the initial list in HISTORY, rather than stating the
> > function's origin in 4.4BSD as a full sentence. This is more concise and
> > consistent with other man pages.
> >
> > Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> > ---
> > man/man2/sysctl.2 | 3 +--
> > 1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 2 deletions(-)
[...]
>
> It actually existed before 4.4BSD. It existed in 2.11BSD at least [1].
>
> Collin
>
> [1] https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=2.11BSD/src/man/man3/sysctl.3

That would be good to include, though we may need to first modify
standards(7) since 2.11BSD currently isn't listed there (the earliest
mentioned is 3BSD).

----
Seth McDonald.
sethmcmail at pm dot me (mailing lists)
2336 E8D2 FEB1 5300 692C  62A9 5839 6AD8 9243 D369

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Is 2.11BSD < 4BSD?  It depends. (was: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix)
  2025-12-30  6:59   ` Collin Funk
  2025-12-30  7:18     ` Seth McDonald
@ 2025-12-30  7:22     ` G. Branden Robinson
  2025-12-30  7:35       ` Is 2.11BSD < 4BSD? It depends Collin Funk
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: G. Branden Robinson @ 2025-12-30  7:22 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Collin Funk; +Cc: seth.i.mcdonald, Alejandro Colomar, Seth McDonald, linux-man

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At 2025-12-29T22:59:11-0800, Collin Funk wrote:
> It actually existed before 4.4BSD. It existed in 2.11BSD at least [1].

Hang on a second.  BSD version numbers are a little funny.

It is true that 1BSD < 2BSD < 3BSD < 4BSD.

After that, things get a little weird.

2BSD targeted only the PDP-11, and swapped out entire processes just as
Unix historically always had.

3BSD targeted the VAX, and supported demand paging--just as UNIX 32/V,
the most recent common ancestor of AT&T System III/V and [34]BSD,
did.[0]

4BSD was a relatively minor update to 3BSD, also exclusively for the
VAX.  4.1BSD was a much bigger deal and would have been 5BSD, except
AT&T blew a gasket over the version numbered, seeking a proprietary
claim over the number five.  This has been discussed just this week on
the TUHS list.[1]

2BSD however was not abandoned as soon as 3BSD or even 4BSD showed up.
Some people still had PDP-11s around.  And thanks to (Open)SIMH, we can
all still run one if we choose.

Features from 3,4BSD got backported to 2BSD, which eventually stabilized
its minor version number at "11", I suspect because that was
irresibility useful to characterize the system's only supported target
architecture.

2.11BSD continues to be maintained today, as a set of literally hundreds
of patches, as Berekeley-flavored Unix aficionadios explore just what
they can do with what is now basically an "embedded system".

The most recent patch I know of is #498, dated 2 September.[2]

I wish we had a modern package manager for the thing.  I've never been
crazy about BSD's "patch && make world" approach.  :-P

Regards,
Branden

[0] The demand-paged kernel was such a big deal that it's why the
    "virtual memory" version of the Unix kernel appeared on disk as
    "vmunix".  The Linux kernel aped this as "vmlinux"--"vmlinuz" for
    its compressed form--even though there has never existed a
    traditionally swapping version.  The more arbitrary and esoteric a
    naming convention is, the more tightly Unix people cling to it.

[1] https://www.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/2025-December/032903.html
[2] https://www.tuhs.org/Archive/Distributions/UCB/2.11BSD/Patches/

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
  2025-12-30  7:18     ` Seth McDonald
@ 2025-12-30  7:27       ` G. Branden Robinson
  2025-12-30  7:40         ` Collin Funk
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: G. Branden Robinson @ 2025-12-30  7:27 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Seth McDonald; +Cc: Collin Funk, Alejandro Colomar, linux-man

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At 2025-12-30T07:18:50+0000, Seth McDonald wrote:
> > [1] https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=2.11BSD/src/man/man3/sysctl.3
> 
> That would be good to include, though we may need to first modify
> standards(7) since 2.11BSD currently isn't listed there (the earliest
> mentioned is 3BSD).

The date on that file, 1993, strongly suggests a backport from the
then-getting-finalized 4.4BSD (which settled out over the course of 1994
and into 1995 depending on whether one considers the "Encumbered" or
"Lite" versions mandated by the settlement of the USL v. BSDI lawsuit).

4.3BSD, by contrast, dates to 1986.  See my previous mail.

So in that sense, a sysctl()-bearing 2.11BSD is more recent than 4.3BSD.

I suggest the Linux man-pages project not attempt to track the
provenance or timeline of 2.11BSD features.  It's too much work.

Regards,
Branden

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: Is 2.11BSD < 4BSD?  It depends.
  2025-12-30  7:22     ` Is 2.11BSD < 4BSD? It depends. (was: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix) G. Branden Robinson
@ 2025-12-30  7:35       ` Collin Funk
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Collin Funk @ 2025-12-30  7:35 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: G. Branden Robinson
  Cc: seth.i.mcdonald, Alejandro Colomar, Seth McDonald, linux-man

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"G. Branden Robinson" <g.branden.robinson@gmail.com> writes:

> At 2025-12-29T22:59:11-0800, Collin Funk wrote:
>> It actually existed before 4.4BSD. It existed in 2.11BSD at least [1].

> 2BSD however was not abandoned as soon as 3BSD or even 4BSD showed up.
> Some people still had PDP-11s around.  And thanks to (Open)SIMH, we can
> all still run one if we choose.
>
> Features from 3,4BSD got backported to 2BSD, which eventually stabilized
> its minor version number at "11", I suspect because that was
> irresibility useful to characterize the system's only supported target
> architecture.

Oh, right. The source I linked has a 1995 date on it that I missed. I
would have realized the mistake if I had, since 4.4BSD is from 1992 or
1993.

Collin

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
  2025-12-30  7:27       ` G. Branden Robinson
@ 2025-12-30  7:40         ` Collin Funk
  2025-12-30  7:53           ` G. Branden Robinson
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: Collin Funk @ 2025-12-30  7:40 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: G. Branden Robinson; +Cc: Seth McDonald, Alejandro Colomar, linux-man

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"G. Branden Robinson" <g.branden.robinson@gmail.com> writes:

> At 2025-12-30T07:18:50+0000, Seth McDonald wrote:
>> > [1] https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=2.11BSD/src/man/man3/sysctl.3
>> 
>> That would be good to include, though we may need to first modify
>> standards(7) since 2.11BSD currently isn't listed there (the earliest
>> mentioned is 3BSD).
>
> The date on that file, 1993, strongly suggests a backport from the
> then-getting-finalized 4.4BSD (which settled out over the course of 1994
> and into 1995 depending on whether one considers the "Encumbered" or
> "Lite" versions mandated by the settlement of the USL v. BSDI lawsuit).
>
> 4.3BSD, by contrast, dates to 1986.  See my previous mail.
>
> So in that sense, a sysctl()-bearing 2.11BSD is more recent than
> 4.3BSD.

It does say 1993, but it also has the following:

    .\"	@(#)sysctl.3	8.1.1 (2.11BSD GTE) 1/13/95
    .\"
    .TH SYSCTL 3 "January 13, 1995"

The first line being used by SCCS? That is an assumption since I have
never used it.

> I suggest the Linux man-pages project not attempt to track the
> provenance or timeline of 2.11BSD features.  It's too much work.

And there is probably not much practical benefit, i.e., just some (very
few, probably) people interested in the history.

Collin

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
  2025-12-30  7:40         ` Collin Funk
@ 2025-12-30  7:53           ` G. Branden Robinson
  2025-12-30 11:34             ` Alejandro Colomar
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 18+ messages in thread
From: G. Branden Robinson @ 2025-12-30  7:53 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Collin Funk; +Cc: Seth McDonald, Alejandro Colomar, linux-man

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Hi Collin,

At 2025-12-29T23:40:11-0800, Collin Funk wrote:
> It does say 1993, but it also has the following:
> 
>     .\"	@(#)sysctl.3	8.1.1 (2.11BSD GTE) 1/13/95
>     .\"
>     .TH SYSCTL 3 "January 13, 1995"
> 
> The first line being used by SCCS? That is an assumption since I have
> never used it.

Yup, that's exactly what it is.

https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9799919799/utilities/what.html

To add precision to my earlier remarks, the "last" Berkeley CSRG release
appears to have been "4.4BSD Lite Release 2", dated May 1995.

https://gunkies.org/wiki/4.4BSD_Lite_Release_2

The "real work" was by then happening as BSDI, where every developer was
assured that their deeply principled avoidance of the viral GPL would
result in billionaire status for them all.  Winning!

> > I suggest the Linux man-pages project not attempt to track the
> > provenance or timeline of 2.11BSD features.  It's too much work.
> 
> And there is probably not much practical benefit, i.e., just some
> (very few, probably) people interested in the history.

I number myself among those few, but without some sort of tool to keep
track of 2BSD + 2.11BSD patches on an _automated_ basis to monitor when
symbols appear and vanish from the source base, I think researching such
history is a poor use of Linux man-pages contributors' time.

Put differently, I would advocate _against_ Alex mandating that
contributors to "HISTORY" sections pin down just when a feature showed
up in 2BSD development specifically.  Without the aforementioned tool, I
think the problem is too hard.  The juice is not worth the squeeze.

If any 2BSD advocates feel slighted, we can always point out that this
project largely uses the GPL, and that they can't expect anything good
to come from sick, evil copyleftists anyway.  😈🤘

Surely they can console themselves by counting their money.

Regards,
Branden

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
  2025-12-30  7:53           ` G. Branden Robinson
@ 2025-12-30 11:34             ` Alejandro Colomar
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Alejandro Colomar @ 2025-12-30 11:34 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: G. Branden Robinson; +Cc: Collin Funk, Seth McDonald, linux-man

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Hi all,

On Tue, Dec 30, 2025 at 01:53:53AM -0600, G. Branden Robinson wrote:
> Hi Collin,
> 
> At 2025-12-29T23:40:11-0800, Collin Funk wrote:
> > It does say 1993, but it also has the following:
> > 
> >     .\"	@(#)sysctl.3	8.1.1 (2.11BSD GTE) 1/13/95
> >     .\"
> >     .TH SYSCTL 3 "January 13, 1995"
> > 
> > The first line being used by SCCS? That is an assumption since I have
> > never used it.
> 
> Yup, that's exactly what it is.
> 
> https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9799919799/utilities/what.html
> 
> To add precision to my earlier remarks, the "last" Berkeley CSRG release
> appears to have been "4.4BSD Lite Release 2", dated May 1995.
> 
> https://gunkies.org/wiki/4.4BSD_Lite_Release_2
> 
> The "real work" was by then happening as BSDI, where every developer was
> assured that their deeply principled avoidance of the viral GPL would
> result in billionaire status for them all.  Winning!
> 
> > > I suggest the Linux man-pages project not attempt to track the
> > > provenance or timeline of 2.11BSD features.  It's too much work.
> > 
> > And there is probably not much practical benefit, i.e., just some
> > (very few, probably) people interested in the history.
> 
> I number myself among those few, but without some sort of tool to keep
> track of 2BSD + 2.11BSD patches on an _automated_ basis to monitor when
> symbols appear and vanish from the source base, I think researching such
> history is a poor use of Linux man-pages contributors' time.
> 
> Put differently, I would advocate _against_ Alex mandating that
> contributors to "HISTORY" sections pin down just when a feature showed
> up in 2BSD development specifically.  Without the aforementioned tool, I
> think the problem is too hard.  The juice is not worth the squeeze.

I certainly won't mandate anything prior to POSIX.1-2001/Cor2-2004
(informally, POSIX.1-2004), as that's the oldest POSIX that is easily
available.  I personally don't check any older sources than that
regularly.

Actually, I'm even starting to ignore anything older than POSIX.1-2008,
because for some reason the search engine at
<https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/009695399/> often fails for
"word search" with

	Not Found

	The requested URL was not found on this server.

so, I'm giving up on POSIX.1-2004 too.  For some reason, the search
engine works fine for more recent POSIX revisions.  The Open Group
website is a terrible thing, and part of the reason I decided to stop
supporting the POSIX manual pages.  The Austin Group would do well
having a talk with whoever is in charge, and fix several things,
including publication of POSIX.1-2001 and POSIX.1-2002, and actually
open their standards (the source code of the standard; WG21 did publish
the source of the C++ drafts and they got away with that).

However, I won't reject patches documenting 2BSD and 3BSD, if some
people are interested in doing the work.


Have a lovely day!
Alex

> 
> If any 2BSD advocates feel slighted, we can always point out that this
> project largely uses the GPL, and that they can't expect anything good
> to come from sick, evil copyleftists anyway.  😈🤘
> 
> Surely they can console themselves by counting their money.
> 
> Regards,
> Branden



-- 
<https://www.alejandro-colomar.es>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 3/4] man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 3/4] man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix seth.i.mcdonald
@ 2025-12-31 13:45   ` Alejandro Colomar
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Alejandro Colomar @ 2025-12-31 13:45 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: seth.i.mcdonald; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1943 bytes --]

Hi Seth,

On Tue, Dec 30, 2025 at 04:42:02PM +1000, seth.i.mcdonald@gmail.com wrote:
> From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> 
> Increments the indentation of the times parameter in the utimes(2)
> prototype by one space.
> 
> Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> ---
>  man/man2/utime.2 | 2 +-
>  1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 1 deletion(-)
> 
> diff --git a/man/man2/utime.2 b/man/man2/utime.2
> index 94307a5b90..e044f15b06 100644
> --- a/man/man2/utime.2
> +++ b/man/man2/utime.2
> @@ -18,7 +18,7 @@ .SH SYNOPSIS
>  .B #include <sys/time.h>
>  .P
>  .BI "int utimes(const char *" path ,
> -.BI "          const struct timeval " times "[_Nullable 2]);"
> +.BI "           const struct timeval " times "[_Nullable 2]);"

The current formatting is intended, and documented in man-pages(7):

     In  the SYNOPSIS, a long function prototype may need to be
     continued over to the next line.  The continuation line is
     indented according to the following rules:

[...]

     (2)  But, where multiple functions in the SYNOPSIS require
          continuation  lines, and the function names have dif‐
          ferent lengths, then align all continuation lines  to
          start in the same column.  This provides a nicer ren‐
          dering  in  PDF  output  (because the SYNOPSIS uses a
          variable width font where spaces render narrower than
          most characters).  As an example:

              int getopt(int argc, char * const argv[],
                         const char *optstring);
              int getopt_long(int argc, char * const argv[],
                         const char *optstring,
                         const struct option *longopts, int *longindex);


Have a lovely day!
Alex

P.S.:  These patches work correctly.  :)

>  .fi
>  .SH DESCRIPTION
>  .B Note:
> -- 
> 2.47.3
> 
> 

-- 
<https://www.alejandro-colomar.es>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix seth.i.mcdonald
  2025-12-30  6:59   ` Collin Funk
@ 2025-12-31 13:46   ` Alejandro Colomar
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Alejandro Colomar @ 2025-12-31 13:46 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: seth.i.mcdonald; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1058 bytes --]

Hi Seth,

On Tue, Dec 30, 2025 at 04:42:01PM +1000, seth.i.mcdonald@gmail.com wrote:
> From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> 
> Include 4.4BSD in the initial list in HISTORY, rather than stating the
> function's origin in 4.4BSD as a full sentence. This is more concise and
> consistent with other man pages.
> 
> Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>

Thanks!  I've applied this patch.


Have a lovely New Year!
Alex

> ---
>  man/man2/sysctl.2 | 3 +--
>  1 file changed, 1 insertion(+), 2 deletions(-)
> 
> diff --git a/man/man2/sysctl.2 b/man/man2/sysctl.2
> index c59acff553..6566c4f5be 100644
> --- a/man/man2/sysctl.2
> +++ b/man/man2/sysctl.2
> @@ -73,11 +73,10 @@ .SH ERRORS
>  .SH STANDARDS
>  Linux.
>  .SH HISTORY
> +4.4BSD,
>  Linux 1.3.57.
>  Removed in Linux 5.5, glibc 2.32.
>  .P
> -It originated in
> -4.4BSD.
>  Only Linux has the
>  .I /proc/sys
>  mirror, and the object naming schemes differ between Linux and 4.4BSD,
> -- 
> 2.47.3
> 
> 

-- 
<https://www.alejandro-colomar.es>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 1/4] man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 1/4] man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section seth.i.mcdonald
@ 2025-12-31 13:46   ` Alejandro Colomar
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Alejandro Colomar @ 2025-12-31 13:46 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: seth.i.mcdonald; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1035 bytes --]

On Tue, Dec 30, 2025 at 04:42:00PM +1000, seth.i.mcdonald@gmail.com wrote:
> From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> 
> Move the description of syscall(2)'s first appearance from NOTES to a
> new HISTORY section.
> 
> Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>

Patch applied; Thanks!

Cheers,
Alex

> ---
>  man/man2/syscall.2 | 3 ++-
>  1 file changed, 2 insertions(+), 1 deletion(-)
> 
> diff --git a/man/man2/syscall.2 b/man/man2/syscall.2
> index be645c0f4a..54385cdfba 100644
> --- a/man/man2/syscall.2
> +++ b/man/man2/syscall.2
> @@ -62,10 +62,11 @@ .SH ERRORS
>  The requested system call number is not implemented.
>  .P
>  Other errors are specific to the invoked system call.
> -.SH NOTES
> +.SH HISTORY
>  .BR syscall ()
>  first appeared in
>  4BSD.
> +.SH NOTES
>  .SS Architecture-specific requirements
>  Each architecture ABI has its own requirements on how
>  system call arguments are passed to the kernel.
> -- 
> 2.47.3
> 
> 

-- 
<https://www.alejandro-colomar.es>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 4/4] man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 4/4] man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix seth.i.mcdonald
@ 2025-12-31 13:47   ` Alejandro Colomar
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Alejandro Colomar @ 2025-12-31 13:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: seth.i.mcdonald; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 888 bytes --]

On Tue, Dec 30, 2025 at 04:42:03PM +1000, seth.i.mcdonald@gmail.com wrote:
> From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> 
> The G and S do look surprisingly similar...
> 
> Signed-off-by: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> ---

Thanks!  Patch applied.


Cheers,
Alex

>  man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const | 4 ++--
>  1 file changed, 2 insertions(+), 2 deletions(-)
> 
> diff --git a/man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const b/man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const
> index 3964cb7fd1..cd99611666 100644
> --- a/man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const
> +++ b/man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const
> @@ -458,13 +458,13 @@ .SH HISTORY
>  .TP
>  .B F_GETOWN_EX
>  .TQ
> -.B F_GETOWN_EX
> +.B F_SETOWN_EX
>  POSIX.1-2024.
>  Linux 2.6.32.
>  .TP
>  .B F_GETSIG
>  .TQ
> -.B F_GETSIG
> +.B F_SETSIG
>  Linux.
>  .SH BUGS
>  .SS F_GETOWN
> -- 
> 2.47.3
> 

-- 
<https://www.alejandro-colomar.es>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

* Re: [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes
  2025-12-30  6:41 [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes seth.i.mcdonald
                   ` (3 preceding siblings ...)
  2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 4/4] man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix seth.i.mcdonald
@ 2025-12-31 13:48 ` Alejandro Colomar
  4 siblings, 0 replies; 18+ messages in thread
From: Alejandro Colomar @ 2025-12-31 13:48 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: seth.i.mcdonald; +Cc: Seth McDonald, linux-man

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1299 bytes --]

On Tue, Dec 30, 2025 at 04:41:59PM +1000, seth.i.mcdonald@gmail.com wrote:
> From: Seth McDonald <sethmcmail@pm.me>
> 
> Hello,

Hi!

> 
> Here's just a few minor fixes I came across.
> 
> Hopefully (fingers crossed) the patches will remain intact this time. If
> so, I may be able to begin sending out some patches for the updated
> HISTORY sections (currently at 109).

Yep, they all worked fine.  I rejected one patch, and applied the
others.  Thanks!


Cheers,
Alex

> 
> Seth McDonald (4):
>   man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section
>   sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
>   man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix
>   man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix
> 
>  man/man2/syscall.2            | 3 ++-
>  man/man2/sysctl.2             | 3 +--
>  man/man2/utime.2              | 2 +-
>  man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const | 4 ++--
>  4 files changed, 6 insertions(+), 6 deletions(-)
> 
> Range-diff against v0:
> -:  ---------- > 1:  a2a2a51ede man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section
> -:  ---------- > 2:  1477de655f sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix
> -:  ---------- > 3:  fad6d60041 man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix
> -:  ---------- > 4:  2f33ba3b5b man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix
> -- 
> 2.47.3
> 

-- 
<https://www.alejandro-colomar.es>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 18+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2025-12-31 13:48 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 18+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2025-12-30  6:41 [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes seth.i.mcdonald
2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 1/4] man/man2/syscall.2: Add HISTORY section seth.i.mcdonald
2025-12-31 13:46   ` Alejandro Colomar
2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix seth.i.mcdonald
2025-12-30  6:59   ` Collin Funk
2025-12-30  7:18     ` Seth McDonald
2025-12-30  7:27       ` G. Branden Robinson
2025-12-30  7:40         ` Collin Funk
2025-12-30  7:53           ` G. Branden Robinson
2025-12-30 11:34             ` Alejandro Colomar
2025-12-30  7:22     ` Is 2.11BSD < 4BSD? It depends. (was: [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix) G. Branden Robinson
2025-12-30  7:35       ` Is 2.11BSD < 4BSD? It depends Collin Funk
2025-12-31 13:46   ` [PATCH v1 2/4] sys/man2/sysctl.2: HISTORY: wfix Alejandro Colomar
2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 3/4] man/man2/utime.2: SYNOPSIS: ffix seth.i.mcdonald
2025-12-31 13:45   ` Alejandro Colomar
2025-12-30  6:42 ` [PATCH v1 4/4] man/man2const/F_GETSIG.2const: HISTORY: tfix seth.i.mcdonald
2025-12-31 13:47   ` Alejandro Colomar
2025-12-31 13:48 ` [PATCH v1 0/4] Miscellaneous fixes Alejandro Colomar

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