Hauppauge WinTV-CI Spec

Hauppauge WinTV-CI Spec

[Steven Toth]

Recap: I said I'd notify the list when the spec was released for the 
Hauppauge CI device.

Hello!

http://www.smardtv.com/index.php?page=dvbci&rubrique=specification

Looks like SmartDTV have finally got something out of the door. Put your 
email address in their database and they'll email you the PDF with full 
command interface describing the protocol.

Regards,

- Steve

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Re: [linux-dvb] Hauppauge WinTV-CI Spec

[Aidan Thornton]

On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org> wrote:
> Recap: I said I'd notify the list when the spec was released for the
>  Hauppauge CI device.
>
>  Hello!
>
>  http://www.smardtv.com/index.php?page=dvbci&rubrique=specification
>
>  Looks like SmartDTV have finally got something out of the door. Put your
>  email address in their database and they'll email you the PDF with full
>  command interface describing the protocol.
>
>  Regards,
>
>  - Steve

Hi,

I'm not sure how that's relevant. It seems to be the spec for
something called CI+, intended to prevent unauthorised systems from
getting access to the decrypted stream coming out the CAM and ensure
only authorised host devices can use CAMs. I expect open source
software will be able to make use of this stuff approximately when
hell freezes over. If this catches on, say hello to more copy
protection and bye-bye to being able to use CAMs under Linux!

Aidan

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Re: [linux-dvb] Hauppauge WinTV-CI Spec

[Steven Toth]

Aidan Thornton wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org> wrote:
>> Recap: I said I'd notify the list when the spec was released for the
>>  Hauppauge CI device.
>>
>>  Hello!
>>
>>  http://www.smardtv.com/index.php?page=dvbci&rubrique=specification
>>
>>  Looks like SmartDTV have finally got something out of the door. Put your
>>  email address in their database and they'll email you the PDF with full
>>  command interface describing the protocol.
>>
>>  Regards,
>>
>>  - Steve
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I'm not sure how that's relevant. It seems to be the spec for
> something called CI+, intended to prevent unauthorised systems from
> getting access to the decrypted stream coming out the CAM and ensure
> only authorised host devices can use CAMs. I expect open source
> software will be able to make use of this stuff approximately when
> hell freezes over. If this catches on, say hello to more copy
> protection and bye-bye to being able to use CAMs under Linux!

A subset of the spec will work with the CI USB device, for those that 
are interested.

- Steve

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Re: [linux-dvb] Hauppauge WinTV-CI Spec

[Steven Toth]

Aidan Thornton wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:57 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org> wrote:
>> Aidan Thornton wrote:
>>  > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org> wrote:
>>  >> Recap: I said I'd notify the list when the spec was released for the
>>  >>  Hauppauge CI device.
>>  >>
>>  >>  Hello!
>>  >>
>>  >>  http://www.smardtv.com/index.php?page=dvbci&rubrique=specification
>>  >>
>>  >>  Looks like SmartDTV have finally got something out of the door. Put your
>>  >>  email address in their database and they'll email you the PDF with full
>>  >>  command interface describing the protocol.
>>  >>
>>  >>  Regards,
>>  >>
>>  >>  - Steve
>>  >
>>  > Hi,
>>  >
>>  > I'm not sure how that's relevant. It seems to be the spec for
>>  > something called CI+, intended to prevent unauthorised systems from
>>  > getting access to the decrypted stream coming out the CAM and ensure
>>  > only authorised host devices can use CAMs. I expect open source
>>  > software will be able to make use of this stuff approximately when
>>  > hell freezes over. If this catches on, say hello to more copy
>>  > protection and bye-bye to being able to use CAMs under Linux!
>>
>>  A subset of the spec will work with the CI USB device, for those that
>>  are interested.
> 
> Yeah, that's what I was wondering about - it doesn't seem to specify
> anything about CI USB devices, just the standard PC card based
> interface. (It even states that it doesn't deal with any interfaces
> other than that one). In what sense does the WinTV-CI implement this -
> does it translate between standard CIs and some subset of this
> protocol done over USB? (I'm not even sure, at a glance, if this makes
> sense.)

I only glanced at the spec, but from what I'm told the command API is 
implemented over USB. I suspect that Luc (the guy working on the Linux 
driver) might be able to consolidate this command set, with the USB logs 
he's been capturing. If not then something is clearly wrong.

I'd been promised this document during December 2007 by the vendor and 
said that I'd post it here to the community as soon as it was released.

- Steve



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Re: [linux-dvb] Hauppauge WinTV-CI Spec

[Derk Dukker]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3618 bytes --]

Hi all,

I was wondering if there is any progress going on at the Hauppauge WinTV CI
usb. I heard that a guy named Luc is currently working on it. Luc do you
have any information about your progress or do you have a site where I/we
can track back the progress? I also noticed that the design of the Hauppauge
WinTV CI usb is quite the same as the Terratec Cinergy CI usb which I
bought. SmarDTV is the vendor of it (I opened the case and on the print
board stood SmarDTV). You can get the specification from the website (see
also earlier emails).
I think both the devices are the same, so when one driver is created it will
probably also works on the terratec cinergy ci. I don't know if the
specification from smarDTV is enough...
I have had contact with the dutch terratec support and asked them if they
can get me the specification to create a linux driver. He said that he would
check it out if it is possible for me to have the specification, as soon as
he knows more he will update me. But that email responds was 1 or 2 weeks
ago. I will email him again. As soon as I got something I will post it here.

regards,

Derk

On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 11:41 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org> wrote:

> Aidan Thornton wrote:
> > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:57 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org> wrote:
> >> Aidan Thornton wrote:
> >>  > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org>
> wrote:
> >>  >> Recap: I said I'd notify the list when the spec was released for
> the
> >>  >>  Hauppauge CI device.
> >>  >>
> >>  >>  Hello!
> >>  >>
> >>  >>  http://www.smardtv.com/index.php?page=dvbci&rubrique=specification
> >>  >>
> >>  >>  Looks like SmartDTV have finally got something out of the door.
> Put your
> >>  >>  email address in their database and they'll email you the PDF with
> full
> >>  >>  command interface describing the protocol.
> >>  >>
> >>  >>  Regards,
> >>  >>
> >>  >>  - Steve
> >>  >
> >>  > Hi,
> >>  >
> >>  > I'm not sure how that's relevant. It seems to be the spec for
> >>  > something called CI+, intended to prevent unauthorised systems from
> >>  > getting access to the decrypted stream coming out the CAM and ensure
> >>  > only authorised host devices can use CAMs. I expect open source
> >>  > software will be able to make use of this stuff approximately when
> >>  > hell freezes over. If this catches on, say hello to more copy
> >>  > protection and bye-bye to being able to use CAMs under Linux!
> >>
> >>  A subset of the spec will work with the CI USB device, for those that
> >>  are interested.
> >
> > Yeah, that's what I was wondering about - it doesn't seem to specify
> > anything about CI USB devices, just the standard PC card based
> > interface. (It even states that it doesn't deal with any interfaces
> > other than that one). In what sense does the WinTV-CI implement this -
> > does it translate between standard CIs and some subset of this
> > protocol done over USB? (I'm not even sure, at a glance, if this makes
> > sense.)
>
> I only glanced at the spec, but from what I'm told the command API is
> implemented over USB. I suspect that Luc (the guy working on the Linux
> driver) might be able to consolidate this command set, with the USB logs
> he's been capturing. If not then something is clearly wrong.
>
> I'd been promised this document during December 2007 by the vendor and
> said that I'd post it here to the community as soon as it was released.
>
> - Steve
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> linux-dvb mailing list
> linux-dvb@linuxtv.org
> http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linux-dvb
>

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Re: [linux-dvb] Hauppauge WinTV-CI Spec

[Steven Toth]

Derk Dukker wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> I was wondering if there is any progress going on at the Hauppauge WinTV 
> CI usb. I heard that a guy named Luc is currently working on it. Luc do 
> you have any information about your progress or do you have a site where 
> I/we can track back the progress? I also noticed that the design of the 
> Hauppauge WinTV CI usb is quite the same as the Terratec Cinergy CI usb 
> which I bought. SmarDTV is the vendor of it (I opened the case and on 
> the print board stood SmarDTV). You can get the specification from the 
> website (see also earlier emails).
> I think both the devices are the same, so when one driver is created it 
> will probably also works on the terratec cinergy ci. I don't know if the 
> specification from smarDTV is enough...
> I have had contact with the dutch terratec support and asked them if 
> they can get me the specification to create a linux driver. He said that 
> he would check it out if it is possible for me to have the 
> specification, as soon as he knows more he will update me. But that 
> email responds was 1 or 2 weeks ago. I will email him again. As soon as 
> I got something I will post it here.

I looked at the published spec and I it looks like it's for a newer 
device yet to hit the market. Trying to read it word for word will 
largely miss-represent what the WinTVCI device is, or its feature set. 
(Although I was at one point convinced this document was a super-set of 
the WinTVCI device).

I also looked at the USB traffic on the current Hauppauge driver, with a 
cam inserted and decryption happening. The protocol appears pretty simple.

I don't like their URB handling and their constant polling of the device 
regardless of whether it's being used or not, but that's likely an ugly 
feature of the windows implementation. I suspect a Linux driver could be 
written to do whatever it likes (mostly).

- Steve



> 
> regards,
> 
> Derk
> 
> On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 11:41 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org 
> <mailto:stoth@linuxtv.org>> wrote:
> 
>     Aidan Thornton wrote:
>      > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:57 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org
>     <mailto:stoth@linuxtv.org>> wrote:
>      >> Aidan Thornton wrote:
>      >>  > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Steven Toth
>     <stoth@linuxtv.org <mailto:stoth@linuxtv.org>> wrote:
>      >>  >> Recap: I said I'd notify the list when the spec was released
>     for the
>      >>  >>  Hauppauge CI device.
>      >>  >>
>      >>  >>  Hello!
>      >>  >>
>      >>  >>
>      http://www.smardtv.com/index.php?page=dvbci&rubrique=specification
>     <http://www.smardtv.com/index.php?page=dvbci&rubrique=specification>
>      >>  >>
>      >>  >>  Looks like SmartDTV have finally got something out of the
>     door. Put your
>      >>  >>  email address in their database and they'll email you the
>     PDF with full
>      >>  >>  command interface describing the protocol.
>      >>  >>
>      >>  >>  Regards,
>      >>  >>
>      >>  >>  - Steve
>      >>  >
>      >>  > Hi,
>      >>  >
>      >>  > I'm not sure how that's relevant. It seems to be the spec for
>      >>  > something called CI+, intended to prevent unauthorised
>     systems from
>      >>  > getting access to the decrypted stream coming out the CAM and
>     ensure
>      >>  > only authorised host devices can use CAMs. I expect open source
>      >>  > software will be able to make use of this stuff approximately
>     when
>      >>  > hell freezes over. If this catches on, say hello to more copy
>      >>  > protection and bye-bye to being able to use CAMs under Linux!
>      >>
>      >>  A subset of the spec will work with the CI USB device, for
>     those that
>      >>  are interested.
>      >
>      > Yeah, that's what I was wondering about - it doesn't seem to specify
>      > anything about CI USB devices, just the standard PC card based
>      > interface. (It even states that it doesn't deal with any interfaces
>      > other than that one). In what sense does the WinTV-CI implement
>     this -
>      > does it translate between standard CIs and some subset of this
>      > protocol done over USB? (I'm not even sure, at a glance, if this
>     makes
>      > sense.)
> 
>     I only glanced at the spec, but from what I'm told the command API is
>     implemented over USB. I suspect that Luc (the guy working on the Linux
>     driver) might be able to consolidate this command set, with the USB logs
>     he's been capturing. If not then something is clearly wrong.
> 
>     I'd been promised this document during December 2007 by the vendor and
>     said that I'd post it here to the community as soon as it was released.
> 
>     - Steve
> 
> 
> 
>     _______________________________________________
>     linux-dvb mailing list
>     linux-dvb@linuxtv.org <mailto:linux-dvb@linuxtv.org>
>     http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linux-dvb
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> linux-dvb mailing list
> linux-dvb@linuxtv.org
> http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linux-dvb


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Re: [linux-dvb] Hauppauge WinTV-CI Spec

[Luc Brosens]

Hi there,

I'm the Luc attempting a driver.  Current status at http://www.bsc-bvba.be/linux/dvb

help and suggestions more than welcome

regards,

Luc

Steven Toth wrote:
> Derk Dukker wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I was wondering if there is any progress going on at the Hauppauge WinTV 
>> CI usb. I heard that a guy named Luc is currently working on it. Luc do 
>> you have any information about your progress or do you have a site where 
>> I/we can track back the progress? I also noticed that the design of the 
>> Hauppauge WinTV CI usb is quite the same as the Terratec Cinergy CI usb 
>> which I bought. SmarDTV is the vendor of it (I opened the case and on 
>> the print board stood SmarDTV). You can get the specification from the 
>> website (see also earlier emails).
>> I think both the devices are the same, so when one driver is created it 
>> will probably also works on the terratec cinergy ci. I don't know if the 
>> specification from smarDTV is enough...
>> I have had contact with the dutch terratec support and asked them if 
>> they can get me the specification to create a linux driver. He said that 
>> he would check it out if it is possible for me to have the 
>> specification, as soon as he knows more he will update me. But that 
>> email responds was 1 or 2 weeks ago. I will email him again. As soon as 
>> I got something I will post it here.
> 
> I looked at the published spec and I it looks like it's for a newer 
> device yet to hit the market. Trying to read it word for word will 
> largely miss-represent what the WinTVCI device is, or its feature set. 
> (Although I was at one point convinced this document was a super-set of 
> the WinTVCI device).
> 
> I also looked at the USB traffic on the current Hauppauge driver, with a 
> cam inserted and decryption happening. The protocol appears pretty simple.
> 
> I don't like their URB handling and their constant polling of the device 
> regardless of whether it's being used or not, but that's likely an ugly 
> feature of the windows implementation. I suspect a Linux driver could be 
> written to do whatever it likes (mostly).
> 
> - Steve
> 
> 
> 
>> regards,
>>
>> Derk
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 11:41 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org 
>> <mailto:stoth@linuxtv.org>> wrote:
>>
>>     Aidan Thornton wrote:
>>      > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:57 PM, Steven Toth <stoth@linuxtv.org
>>     <mailto:stoth@linuxtv.org>> wrote:
>>      >> Aidan Thornton wrote:
>>      >>  > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Steven Toth
>>     <stoth@linuxtv.org <mailto:stoth@linuxtv.org>> wrote:
>>      >>  >> Recap: I said I'd notify the list when the spec was released
>>     for the
>>      >>  >>  Hauppauge CI device.
>>      >>  >>
>>      >>  >>  Hello!
>>      >>  >>
>>      >>  >>
>>      http://www.smardtv.com/index.php?page=dvbci&rubrique=specification
>>     <http://www.smardtv.com/index.php?page=dvbci&rubrique=specification>
>>      >>  >>
>>      >>  >>  Looks like SmartDTV have finally got something out of the
>>     door. Put your
>>      >>  >>  email address in their database and they'll email you the
>>     PDF with full
>>      >>  >>  command interface describing the protocol.
>>      >>  >>
>>      >>  >>  Regards,
>>      >>  >>
>>      >>  >>  - Steve
>>      >>  >
>>      >>  > Hi,
>>      >>  >
>>      >>  > I'm not sure how that's relevant. It seems to be the spec for
>>      >>  > something called CI+, intended to prevent unauthorised
>>     systems from
>>      >>  > getting access to the decrypted stream coming out the CAM and
>>     ensure
>>      >>  > only authorised host devices can use CAMs. I expect open source
>>      >>  > software will be able to make use of this stuff approximately
>>     when
>>      >>  > hell freezes over. If this catches on, say hello to more copy
>>      >>  > protection and bye-bye to being able to use CAMs under Linux!
>>      >>
>>      >>  A subset of the spec will work with the CI USB device, for
>>     those that
>>      >>  are interested.
>>      >
>>      > Yeah, that's what I was wondering about - it doesn't seem to specify
>>      > anything about CI USB devices, just the standard PC card based
>>      > interface. (It even states that it doesn't deal with any interfaces
>>      > other than that one). In what sense does the WinTV-CI implement
>>     this -
>>      > does it translate between standard CIs and some subset of this
>>      > protocol done over USB? (I'm not even sure, at a glance, if this
>>     makes
>>      > sense.)
>>
>>     I only glanced at the spec, but from what I'm told the command API is
>>     implemented over USB. I suspect that Luc (the guy working on the Linux
>>     driver) might be able to consolidate this command set, with the USB logs
>>     he's been capturing. If not then something is clearly wrong.
>>
>>     I'd been promised this document during December 2007 by the vendor and
>>     said that I'd post it here to the community as soon as it was released.
>>
>>     - Steve
>>
>>
>>
>>     _______________________________________________
>>     linux-dvb mailing list
>>     linux-dvb@linuxtv.org <mailto:linux-dvb@linuxtv.org>
>>     http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linux-dvb
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> linux-dvb mailing list
>> linux-dvb@linuxtv.org
>> http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linux-dvb
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> linux-dvb mailing list
> linux-dvb@linuxtv.org
> http://www.linuxtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linux-dvb
> 

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