From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from smtp.kernel.org (aws-us-west-2-korg-mail-alma10-1.taild15c8.ts.net [100.103.45.18]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.subspace.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B7B9339282C; Tue, 16 Jun 2026 15:49:02 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; arc=none smtp.client-ip=100.103.45.18 ARC-Seal:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1781624943; cv=none; b=QHc2a7ikmJUfhXa3JSo+B6cbs2vOG5NSYIQNQMgpxIwagpjeWoz7N8nUvOqdZMarNRWYbjZ/cvaDPFDDsDqTSg8VWNpNJqsewXVMjZBoaxIBWBiLeu09mf6mAdR5H1AlIFJ+MMzbIbuGpnp8ImGtm2ea3hdy1+Lne0J6jAwWHa4= ARC-Message-Signature:i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=subspace.kernel.org; s=arc-20240116; t=1781624943; c=relaxed/simple; bh=NQKEtwuJplslo1S0a1EuGFXO5pQxOKxvj/9PhHq1Gw0=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=eAsEYpyUHsE2ca0dy5FYNCEzzNhAYhmc2CzqGzuncP41+T73jgsm/NbNYiWT4CGlI7p88iDoWks/FUhVTtFzJbW//E5NfT+Td0/Se3x3vOF44LElgN5C2OUatuTcmDDXxKFGTvzQESOG8tqSrtXBysaizhC13eRNPvpu19EEcg8= ARC-Authentication-Results:i=1; smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=kernel.org header.i=@kernel.org header.b=K1Zgu4IM; arc=none smtp.client-ip=100.103.45.18 Authentication-Results: smtp.subspace.kernel.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=kernel.org header.i=@kernel.org header.b="K1Zgu4IM" Received: by smtp.kernel.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D13EC1F00A3A; Tue, 16 Jun 2026 15:49:01 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=kernel.org; s=k20260515; t=1781624942; bh=LwBPJI0zIYaGqkx1gEaeFo2rsRmh3p4qrOGbWDxyeO0=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References; b=K1Zgu4IMExh7jVVg+2IFXKcFfxCtgqqknPSgNk95pMqsypDLzD2QVFu6TptWzkDGZ 1YRTc4b7aRDRfRCJLepsIdRKV5PlqaJRGKGzjOzgErOK+HC6N+5vicmrEDClCyYvrG YEm5iik1EYQiaWU5qzafp8VM/hJ1QPW6iusrwEaaSZWtD/CtGIzbai0Z2JCQJPH2nz 4I/CEpzHPrk0WGCzwnkZeJSrepcJ3biv4V1RH6JUebicDQcaPZifoORh3ZbSOpE+do CDP1qjdZij4tJYT85PBnJMjWGjmTmywO1no7Rx4VzWJeyaIo6tBSEENR2qURrq5B8B wOgf3aKc7W4kg== Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2026 08:49:01 -0700 From: Jakub Kicinski To: Carsten Strotmann Cc: John Paul Adrian Glaubitz , davem@davemloft.net, netdev@vger.kernel.org, edumazet@google.com, pabeni@redhat.com, andrew+netdev@lunn.ch, horms@kernel.org, geert@linux-m68k.org, chleroy@kernel.org, npiggin@gmail.com, mpe@ellerman.id.au, maddy@linux.ibm.com, linux-mips@vger.kernel.org, linux-m68k@lists.linux-m68k.org, linuxppc-dev@lists.ozlabs.org Subject: Re: [PATCH net-next 0/2] appletalk: move the protocol out of tree Message-ID: <20260616084901.3319d82e@kernel.org> In-Reply-To: References: <20260615222935.947233-1-kuba@kernel.org> <20260615175535.5bc56cfc@kernel.org> Precedence: bulk X-Mailing-List: linux-mips@vger.kernel.org List-Id: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Tue, 16 Jun 2026 09:13:46 +0200 Carsten Strotmann wrote: > I'm a user of AppleTalk and other "Retro"-Features in the Linux Kernel. > > On 16 Jun 2026, at 2:55, Jakub Kicinski wrote: > > > We can complain about the AI slop til the cows comes home. > > I don't like it, you don't like it. What difference does it make? > > > > If y'all have real solutions please share. Complaining about > > "commercial interests" and "nuk[ing] everything in a panic reaction" > > is not helpful. > > the solution, as Adrian pointed out, is to leave these features in > the Linux kernel but have them disabled by default. I think y'all need to internalize that "just leave it in" means work. _Someone_ has to handle the reports and patches. And since nobody is doing that the code is going to GitHub, where it can continue to "just be left" or whatever, without racking up CVEs for the Linux kernel and leading to maintainer burn out :/ > Maybe put a warning message in the kernel config tools that people > should only enable these if they know what they are doing. > > These "retro"-features should not pose any security risk of they are > not compiled into a kernel. Nobody is stopping you from using this code! It's perfectly suitable to be an out of tree module. Maybe it'd be harder if someone wanted to remove a CPU architecture you want to use, but protocols are perfectly fine as loadable modules. You can continue to use the code from: https://github.com/linux-netdev/mod-orphan Presumably you could get Debian to package that and you wouldn't even know the sources no longer live in the kernel tree.