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From: Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>
To: "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com>
Cc: Chris Mason <chris.mason@oracle.com>,
	Christian Borntraeger <borntraeger@de.ibm.com>,
	Nick Piggin <nickpiggin@yahoo.com.au>,
	linux-mm@kvack.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	Martin Schwidefsky <schwidefsky@de.ibm.com>,
	Theodore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu>,
	stable@kernel.org
Subject: Re: [RFC][PATCH] block: Isolate the buffer cache in it's own mappings.
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 21:32:16 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20071017213216.b2d0c4bd.akpm@linux-foundation.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <m1tzopaxa1.fsf_-_@ebiederm.dsl.xmission.com>

On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 21:59:02 -0600 ebiederm@xmission.com (Eric W. Biederman) wrote:

> If filesystems care at all they want absolute control over the buffer
> cache.  Controlling which buffers are dirty and when.  Because we
> keep the buffer cache in the page cache for the block device we have
> not quite been giving filesystems that control leading to really weird
> bugs.
> 
> In addition this tieing of the implemetation of block device caching
> and the buffer cache has resulted in a much more complicated and
> limited implementation then necessary.  Block devices for example
> don't need buffer_heads, and it is perfectly reasonable to cache
> block devices in high memory.
> 
> To start untangling the worst of this mess this patch introduces a
> second block device inode for the buffer cache.  All buffer cache
> operations are diverted to that use the new bd_metadata_inode, which
> keeps the weirdness of the metadata requirements isolated in their
> own little world.

I don't think we little angels want to tread here.  There are so many
weirdo things out there which will break if we bust the coherence between
the fs and /dev/hda1.  Online resize, online fs checkers, various local
tools which people have hacked up to look at metadata in a live fs,
direct-io access to the underlying fs, heaven knows how many boot loader
installers, etc.  Cerainly I couldn't enumerate tham all.

The mere thought of all this scares the crap out of me.


I don't actually see what the conceptual problem is with the existing
implementation.  The buffer_head is a finer-grained view onto the
blockdev's pagecache: it provides additional states and additional locking
against a finer-grained section of the page.   It works well.

Yeah, the highmem thing is a bit of a problem (but waning in importance). 
But we can fix that by teaching individual filesystems about kmap and then
tweak the blockdev's caching policy with mapping_set_gfp_mask() at mount
time.  If anyone cares, which they don't.

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  reply	other threads:[~2007-10-18  4:32 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 77+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2007-10-15  8:28 [PATCH resend] ramdisk: fix zeroed ramdisk pages on memory pressure Christian Borntraeger
2007-10-15 14:06 ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-15  9:05   ` Christian Borntraeger
2007-10-15 14:38     ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-15 18:38       ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-15 22:37         ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-15 22:40           ` [PATCH] rd: Preserve the dirty bit in init_page_buffers() Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-15 22:42             ` [PATCH] rd: Mark ramdisk buffers heads dirty Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-16  7:56               ` Christian Borntraeger
2007-10-16  9:22                 ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-17 16:14                 ` Christian Borntraeger
2007-10-17 17:57                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-17 19:14                     ` Chris Mason
2007-10-17 20:29                       ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-17 20:54                         ` Chris Mason
2007-10-17 21:30                           ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-17 22:58                             ` Chris Mason
2007-10-17 23:28                               ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-18  0:03                                 ` Chris Mason
2007-10-18  3:27                                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-18  3:59                                   ` [RFC][PATCH] block: Isolate the buffer cache in it's own mappings Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-18  4:32                                     ` Andrew Morton [this message]
2007-10-19 21:27                                       ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-21  4:24                                         ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-21  4:53                                           ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-21  5:36                                             ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-21  7:09                                               ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-22  0:15                                           ` David Chinner
2007-10-18  5:10                                     ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-19 21:35                                       ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-17 21:48                     ` [PATCH] rd: Mark ramdisk buffers heads dirty Christian Borntraeger
2007-10-17 22:22                       ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-18  9:26                         ` Christian Borntraeger
2007-10-19 22:46                           ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-19 22:51                           ` [PATCH] rd: Use a private inode for backing storage Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-21  4:28                             ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-21  5:10                               ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-21  5:24                                 ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-21  6:48                                   ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-21  7:28                                     ` Christian Borntraeger
2007-10-21  8:23                                       ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-21  9:56                                         ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-21 18:39                                           ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-22  1:56                                             ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-22 13:11                                             ` Chris Mason
2007-10-21  9:39                                     ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-21 17:56                                       ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-22  0:29                                         ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  8:19               ` [PATCH] rd: Mark ramdisk buffers heads dirty Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  8:48                 ` Christian Borntraeger
2007-10-16 19:06                 ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-16 22:06                   ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  8:12             ` [PATCH] rd: Preserve the dirty bit in init_page_buffers() Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  9:35               ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-15  9:16   ` [PATCH resend] ramdisk: fix zeroed ramdisk pages on memory pressure Andrew Morton
2007-10-15 15:23     ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  3:14       ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-16  6:45         ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  4:57           ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-16  8:08             ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  7:47               ` [patch][rfc] rewrite ramdisk Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  7:52                 ` Jan Engelhardt
2007-10-16  8:07                   ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  8:17                     ` Jan Engelhardt
2007-10-16  8:26                       ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-16  8:53                         ` Jan Engelhardt
2007-10-16  9:08                 ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-16 21:28                 ` Theodore Tso
2007-10-16 22:08                   ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-16 23:48                     ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-17  0:28                       ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-17  1:13                         ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-17  1:47                           ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-17 10:30                 ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-17 12:49                   ` Nick Piggin
2007-10-17 18:45                     ` Eric W. Biederman
2007-10-18  1:06                       ` Nick Piggin

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